On May 3, 5:18 am, pws <pwshel...@austin.rr.com> wrote:
> Ashton Crusher wrote:
> > I think one of Fords (and Chevy's) problems is that their car designs
> > suck. Every time I see a Fusion, or Milan, or the new Lincoln, etc on
> > the road I am struck by how ugly they are. Pretty much the same for
> > most of the Chevy's.
>
> > By contrast, look at the Nissan Altima. It's just a basic mid level
> > car but it looks NICE and they have made it look like QUALITY thru the
> > choices of materials and other design features. On some of the
> > Chevy's one of the things that often catches my eye is how things like
> > the parking lot rub strip doesn't even seem like it was glued on
> > straight. And don't get me started on the huge amount of cheap
> > plastic they glue to every Pontiac that comes down the assembly line.
>
> Wow, it is like I could have written that myself. I will never,
> absolutely never, buy another American car unless the intention is to
> immediately sell it for a profit somehow.
>
> Show me one American car that does not have a better but comparable
> Japanese offering. I thought that the Corvette was the sole exception
> due to the price/performance combination until recently.
>
i'd say that fusion is miles ahead of toyolet camry.
if i needed a midsize pigster i'd buy accord but if there was no
accord
and the choice is fusion or camry it's a no brainer.

i'm surprised toyolet sells so many of these couches on wheels
while there are comparable and better cars like fusion,
but, then, there are a ton of priuses bought by someone so i digress

 

Jeff wrote:
>
> "jim beam" <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote in message
> news:2bmdnRO5vdwAKaHbnZ2dnUVZ_v2knZ2d@speakeasy.ne t...
>> Jeff wrote:
>>>
>>> "Wade" <nugr**v*@excite.com> wrote in message
>>> news:bvadnezc3JJZBaHbnZ2dnUVZ_hOdnZ2d@comcast.com. ..
>>>> My problem with American cars is not with design. Some of them look
>>>> quite nice. It's the long term quality of the car. My wife gets a
>>>> new company car every couple of years. The are usually great for the
>>>> 30K miles or so. Around 35 to 40K they start have little issues,
>>>> they seem to get louder and the ride is a noticeably rougher. On a
>>>> couple of the vehicles you could feel the transmission start to
>>>> slip. By the time she turns it in at around 60K miles, we can't wait
>>>> to get rid of it.
>>>
>>> I have a '97 Contour with over 140k mi on it. It still runs and
>>> handles great. Great long-term quality.
>>>
>>> I have heard similar things about other Fords, Toyotas, Chevys,
>>> Hondas, etc.
>>>
>>> They all make good cars that last a long time.
>>
>> that's a crock dude. go to a junk yard. check out the age and
>> mileage of the vehicles there. here in ca, there's hardly any hondas
>> younger than 92, and even if there is one, it's only because it's been
>> smashed beyond repair. detroit otoh has vehicle less than 10 years
>> vintage being junked, and they're worn out at 1/3rd the mileage.
>
> Some of the Michigan 3 models last a long time. Not all of them.

define "a long time". and state which models you have in mind.

bottom line, you're making a blanket statement that is not supported by
the facts. junk yards are the true exhibition of a vehicle's viability.
if detroit product starts showing up in junk yards TEN YEARS before
nippon product, using language like "long term quality" is simply
self-delusional.

it's even more self-delusional when you consider that nippon
manufacturers make their vehicles here, from locally sourced parts, and
/still/ detroit can't compete. why? because detroit doesn't want to.
they have a buyer base that continues to buy their over-priced,
unreliable, poor quality junk regardless of logic or economics. and as
long as people are that stupid, the rip-off will continue. it's not
like it's even supporting many american jobs - detroit's busily
outsourcing component manufacture to china as fast as it can. want to
save american jobs? buy japanese!

>
> Jeff
>
>>>
>>> Just what models did your wife get?
>>>
>>> Jeff
>

 

Jeff wrote:
>
> "jim beam" <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote in message
> news:2bmdnRO5vdwAKaHbnZ2dnUVZ_v2knZ2d@speakeasy.ne t...
>> Jeff wrote:
>>>
>>> "Wade" <nugr**v*@excite.com> wrote in message
>>> news:bvadnezc3JJZBaHbnZ2dnUVZ_hOdnZ2d@comcast.com. ..
>>>> My problem with American cars is not with design. Some of them look
>>>> quite nice. It's the long term quality of the car. My wife gets a
>>>> new company car every couple of years. The are usually great for the
>>>> 30K miles or so. Around 35 to 40K they start have little issues,
>>>> they seem to get louder and the ride is a noticeably rougher. On a
>>>> couple of the vehicles you could feel the transmission start to
>>>> slip. By the time she turns it in at around 60K miles, we can't wait
>>>> to get rid of it.
>>>
>>> I have a '97 Contour with over 140k mi on it. It still runs and
>>> handles great. Great long-term quality.
>>>
>>> I have heard similar things about other Fords, Toyotas, Chevys,
>>> Hondas, etc.
>>>
>>> They all make good cars that last a long time.
>>
>> that's a crock dude. go to a junk yard. check out the age and
>> mileage of the vehicles there. here in ca, there's hardly any hondas
>> younger than 92, and even if there is one, it's only because it's been
>> smashed beyond repair. detroit otoh has vehicle less than 10 years
>> vintage being junked, and they're worn out at 1/3rd the mileage.
>
> Some of the Michigan 3 models last a long time. Not all of them.

define "a long time". and state which models you have in mind.

bottom line, you're making a blanket statement that is not supported by
the facts. junk yards are the true exhibition of a vehicle's viability.
if detroit product starts showing up in junk yards TEN YEARS before
nippon product, using language like "long term quality" is simply
self-delusional.

it's even more self-delusional when you consider that nippon
manufacturers make their vehicles here, from locally sourced parts, and
/still/ detroit can't compete. why? because detroit doesn't want to.
they have a buyer base that continues to buy their over-priced,
unreliable, poor quality junk regardless of logic or economics. and as
long as people are that stupid, the rip-off will continue. it's not
like it's even supporting many american jobs - detroit's busily
outsourcing component manufacture to china as fast as it can. want to
save american jobs? buy japanese!

>
> Jeff
>
>>>
>>> Just what models did your wife get?
>>>
>>> Jeff
>

 

Let's see if I can remember them all
Jeep Cherokee - The worst. This thing was in the shop ever few months.
brake, transmission and axel problems. She went over some train tracks
once, not hard mind you and the steering wheel became off center. The
steering wheel always look like she was turning left even when she was
driving straight. This happened twice.

Ford Escape - great for the first 35K, then got noisy and the transmission
started slipping.

Dodge Grand Caravan - was okay

Ford Windstar ***** and parts started falling off within the first few
thousand miles. We only had this car for about 20K, she then changed jobs.

Pontiac Grand Prix was okay, then developed a a clicking in the steering
wheel. The steering wasn't smooth, you could feel while turning.

Chevrolet Equinox- only had this one for 8K, job change again. Was fairly
nice vehicle. Ride was way too soft though, felt like we were floating.


"Jeff" <news@googlemail.com> wrote in message
news:T%1%h.176$HR1.174@trnddc01...
>
> "Wade" <nugr**v*@excite.com> wrote in message
> news:bvadnezc3JJZBaHbnZ2dnUVZ_hOdnZ2d@comcast.com. ..
>> My problem with American cars is not with design. Some of them look quite
>> nice. It's the long term quality of the car. My wife gets a new company
>> car every couple of years. The are usually great for the 30K miles or so.
>> Around 35 to 40K they start have little issues, they seem to get louder
>> and the ride is a noticeably rougher. On a couple of the vehicles you
>> could feel the transmission start to slip. By the time she turns it in at
>> around 60K miles, we can't wait to get rid of it.
>
> I have a '97 Contour with over 140k mi on it. It still runs and handles
> great. Great long-term quality.
>
> I have heard similar things about other Fords, Toyotas, Chevys, Hondas,
> etc.
>
> They all make good cars that last a long time.
>
> Just what models did your wife get?
>
> Jeff

 

Let's see if I can remember them all
Jeep Cherokee - The worst. This thing was in the shop ever few months.
brake, transmission and axel problems. She went over some train tracks
once, not hard mind you and the steering wheel became off center. The
steering wheel always look like she was turning left even when she was
driving straight. This happened twice.

Ford Escape - great for the first 35K, then got noisy and the transmission
started slipping.

Dodge Grand Caravan - was okay

Ford Windstar ***** and parts started falling off within the first few
thousand miles. We only had this car for about 20K, she then changed jobs.

Pontiac Grand Prix was okay, then developed a a clicking in the steering
wheel. The steering wasn't smooth, you could feel while turning.

Chevrolet Equinox- only had this one for 8K, job change again. Was fairly
nice vehicle. Ride was way too soft though, felt like we were floating.


"Jeff" <news@googlemail.com> wrote in message
news:T%1%h.176$HR1.174@trnddc01...
>
> "Wade" <nugr**v*@excite.com> wrote in message
> news:bvadnezc3JJZBaHbnZ2dnUVZ_hOdnZ2d@comcast.com. ..
>> My problem with American cars is not with design. Some of them look quite
>> nice. It's the long term quality of the car. My wife gets a new company
>> car every couple of years. The are usually great for the 30K miles or so.
>> Around 35 to 40K they start have little issues, they seem to get louder
>> and the ride is a noticeably rougher. On a couple of the vehicles you
>> could feel the transmission start to slip. By the time she turns it in at
>> around 60K miles, we can't wait to get rid of it.
>
> I have a '97 Contour with over 140k mi on it. It still runs and handles
> great. Great long-term quality.
>
> I have heard similar things about other Fords, Toyotas, Chevys, Hondas,
> etc.
>
> They all make good cars that last a long time.
>
> Just what models did your wife get?
>
> Jeff

 

"jim beam" <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote in message
news:ZqadnUelPJDKI6HbnZ2dnUVZ_jydnZ2d@speakeasy.ne t...
> Jeff wrote:
>>
>> "jim beam" <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote in message
>> news:2bmdnRO5vdwAKaHbnZ2dnUVZ_v2knZ2d@speakeasy.ne t...
>>> Jeff wrote:
>>>>
>>>> "Wade" <nugr**v*@excite.com> wrote in message
>>>> news:bvadnezc3JJZBaHbnZ2dnUVZ_hOdnZ2d@comcast.com. ..
>>>>> My problem with American cars is not with design. Some of them look
>>>>> quite nice. It's the long term quality of the car. My wife gets a new
>>>>> company car every couple of years. The are usually great for the 30K
>>>>> miles or so. Around 35 to 40K they start have little issues, they seem
>>>>> to get louder and the ride is a noticeably rougher. On a couple of the
>>>>> vehicles you could feel the transmission start to slip. By the time
>>>>> she turns it in at around 60K miles, we can't wait to get rid of it.
>>>>
>>>> I have a '97 Contour with over 140k mi on it. It still runs and handles
>>>> great. Great long-term quality.
>>>>
>>>> I have heard similar things about other Fords, Toyotas, Chevys, Hondas,
>>>> etc.
>>>>
>>>> They all make good cars that last a long time.
>>>
>>> that's a crock dude. go to a junk yard. check out the age and mileage
>>> of the vehicles there. here in ca, there's hardly any hondas younger
>>> than 92, and even if there is one, it's only because it's been smashed
>>> beyond repair. detroit otoh has vehicle less than 10 years vintage
>>> being junked, and they're worn out at 1/3rd the mileage.
>>
>> Some of the Michigan 3 models last a long time. Not all of them.
>
> define "a long time". and state which models you have in mind.

Ford Contour, Ford Taurus and Mercury Sable, Mercury Mistake and Ford
Escort, Ford F150, Chevy Silverado, Dodge Ram. I am not sure which GM and
Diamler/Chrysler cars go a long way.

> bottom line, you're making a blanket statement that is not supported by
> the facts.

Gee, some of the Michigan 3 models is not a blanket statement.

> junk yards are the true exhibition of a vehicle's viability.

And there were more American cars sold than Japanese cars.

> if detroit product starts showing up in junk yards TEN YEARS before
> nippon product, using language like "long term quality" is simply
> self-delusional.

I did not know Nippon made cars.

> it's even more self-delusional when you consider that nippon manufacturers
> make their vehicles here, from locally sourced parts, and /still/ detroit
> can't compete. why? because detroit doesn't want to.

In your opinion.

> they have a buyer base that continues to buy their over-priced,
> unreliable, poor quality junk regardless of logic or economics. and as
> long as people are that stupid, the rip-off will continue. it's not like
> it's even supporting many american jobs - detroit's busily outsourcing
> component manufacture to china as fast as it can. want to save american
> jobs? buy japanese!

About 75% to 80% of American-brand car components are made in the US vs.
about 50% for Toyota and Honda.

Get a clue a man. If you can find one.

Jeff

>> Jeff
>>
>>>>
>>>> Just what models did your wife get?
>>>>
>>>> Jeff
>>

 

"jim beam" <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote in message
news:ZqadnUelPJDKI6HbnZ2dnUVZ_jydnZ2d@speakeasy.ne t...
> Jeff wrote:
>>
>> "jim beam" <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote in message
>> news:2bmdnRO5vdwAKaHbnZ2dnUVZ_v2knZ2d@speakeasy.ne t...
>>> Jeff wrote:
>>>>
>>>> "Wade" <nugr**v*@excite.com> wrote in message
>>>> news:bvadnezc3JJZBaHbnZ2dnUVZ_hOdnZ2d@comcast.com. ..
>>>>> My problem with American cars is not with design. Some of them look
>>>>> quite nice. It's the long term quality of the car. My wife gets a new
>>>>> company car every couple of years. The are usually great for the 30K
>>>>> miles or so. Around 35 to 40K they start have little issues, they seem
>>>>> to get louder and the ride is a noticeably rougher. On a couple of the
>>>>> vehicles you could feel the transmission start to slip. By the time
>>>>> she turns it in at around 60K miles, we can't wait to get rid of it.
>>>>
>>>> I have a '97 Contour with over 140k mi on it. It still runs and handles
>>>> great. Great long-term quality.
>>>>
>>>> I have heard similar things about other Fords, Toyotas, Chevys, Hondas,
>>>> etc.
>>>>
>>>> They all make good cars that last a long time.
>>>
>>> that's a crock dude. go to a junk yard. check out the age and mileage
>>> of the vehicles there. here in ca, there's hardly any hondas younger
>>> than 92, and even if there is one, it's only because it's been smashed
>>> beyond repair. detroit otoh has vehicle less than 10 years vintage
>>> being junked, and they're worn out at 1/3rd the mileage.
>>
>> Some of the Michigan 3 models last a long time. Not all of them.
>
> define "a long time". and state which models you have in mind.

Ford Contour, Ford Taurus and Mercury Sable, Mercury Mistake and Ford
Escort, Ford F150, Chevy Silverado, Dodge Ram. I am not sure which GM and
Diamler/Chrysler cars go a long way.

> bottom line, you're making a blanket statement that is not supported by
> the facts.

Gee, some of the Michigan 3 models is not a blanket statement.

> junk yards are the true exhibition of a vehicle's viability.

And there were more American cars sold than Japanese cars.

> if detroit product starts showing up in junk yards TEN YEARS before
> nippon product, using language like "long term quality" is simply
> self-delusional.

I did not know Nippon made cars.

> it's even more self-delusional when you consider that nippon manufacturers
> make their vehicles here, from locally sourced parts, and /still/ detroit
> can't compete. why? because detroit doesn't want to.

In your opinion.

> they have a buyer base that continues to buy their over-priced,
> unreliable, poor quality junk regardless of logic or economics. and as
> long as people are that stupid, the rip-off will continue. it's not like
> it's even supporting many american jobs - detroit's busily outsourcing
> component manufacture to china as fast as it can. want to save american
> jobs? buy japanese!

About 75% to 80% of American-brand car components are made in the US vs.
about 50% for Toyota and Honda.

Get a clue a man. If you can find one.

Jeff

>> Jeff
>>
>>>>
>>>> Just what models did your wife get?
>>>>
>>>> Jeff
>>

 

"Wade" <nugr**v*@excite.com> wrote in message
news:YIqdnaG7s-5JIqHbnZ2dnUVZ_oKnnZ2d@comcast.com...
> Let's see if I can remember them all
> Jeep Cherokee - The worst.

My uncle had a Jeep Cherokee that went over 200,000 mi without problems or
even replacing the brake pads. It was kind of cold in the winter though.
Needed a new thermostat.

>This thing was in the shop ever few months.
> brake, transmission and axel problems. She went over some train tracks
> once, not hard mind you and the steering wheel became off center. The
> steering wheel always look like she was turning left even when she was
> driving straight. This happened twice.
>
> Ford Escape - great for the first 35K, then got noisy and the transmission
> started slipping.
>
> Dodge Grand Caravan - was okay
>
> Ford Windstar ***** and parts started falling off within the first few
> thousand miles. We only had this car for about 20K, she then changed jobs.
>
> Pontiac Grand Prix was okay, then developed a a clicking in the steering
> wheel. The steering wasn't smooth, you could feel while turning.
>
> Chevrolet Equinox- only had this one for 8K, job change again. Was fairly
> nice vehicle. Ride was way too soft though, felt like we were floating.

Likewise, you're going to find people who have had excellent service from
these vehicles and others who didn't. Likewise for the Toyotas and Hondas.

Jeff

> "Jeff" <news@googlemail.com> wrote in message
> news:T%1%h.176$HR1.174@trnddc01...
>>
>> "Wade" <nugr**v*@excite.com> wrote in message
>> news:bvadnezc3JJZBaHbnZ2dnUVZ_hOdnZ2d@comcast.com. ..
>>> My problem with American cars is not with design. Some of them look
>>> quite nice. It's the long term quality of the car. My wife gets a new
>>> company car every couple of years. The are usually great for the 30K
>>> miles or so. Around 35 to 40K they start have little issues, they seem
>>> to get louder and the ride is a noticeably rougher. On a couple of the
>>> vehicles you could feel the transmission start to slip. By the time she
>>> turns it in at around 60K miles, we can't wait to get rid of it.
>>
>> I have a '97 Contour with over 140k mi on it. It still runs and handles
>> great. Great long-term quality.
>>
>> I have heard similar things about other Fords, Toyotas, Chevys, Hondas,
>> etc.
>>
>> They all make good cars that last a long time.
>>
>> Just what models did your wife get?
>>
>> Jeff
>

 

"Wade" <nugr**v*@excite.com> wrote in message
news:YIqdnaG7s-5JIqHbnZ2dnUVZ_oKnnZ2d@comcast.com...
> Let's see if I can remember them all
> Jeep Cherokee - The worst.

My uncle had a Jeep Cherokee that went over 200,000 mi without problems or
even replacing the brake pads. It was kind of cold in the winter though.
Needed a new thermostat.

>This thing was in the shop ever few months.
> brake, transmission and axel problems. She went over some train tracks
> once, not hard mind you and the steering wheel became off center. The
> steering wheel always look like she was turning left even when she was
> driving straight. This happened twice.
>
> Ford Escape - great for the first 35K, then got noisy and the transmission
> started slipping.
>
> Dodge Grand Caravan - was okay
>
> Ford Windstar ***** and parts started falling off within the first few
> thousand miles. We only had this car for about 20K, she then changed jobs.
>
> Pontiac Grand Prix was okay, then developed a a clicking in the steering
> wheel. The steering wasn't smooth, you could feel while turning.
>
> Chevrolet Equinox- only had this one for 8K, job change again. Was fairly
> nice vehicle. Ride was way too soft though, felt like we were floating.

Likewise, you're going to find people who have had excellent service from
these vehicles and others who didn't. Likewise for the Toyotas and Hondas.

Jeff

> "Jeff" <news@googlemail.com> wrote in message
> news:T%1%h.176$HR1.174@trnddc01...
>>
>> "Wade" <nugr**v*@excite.com> wrote in message
>> news:bvadnezc3JJZBaHbnZ2dnUVZ_hOdnZ2d@comcast.com. ..
>>> My problem with American cars is not with design. Some of them look
>>> quite nice. It's the long term quality of the car. My wife gets a new
>>> company car every couple of years. The are usually great for the 30K
>>> miles or so. Around 35 to 40K they start have little issues, they seem
>>> to get louder and the ride is a noticeably rougher. On a couple of the
>>> vehicles you could feel the transmission start to slip. By the time she
>>> turns it in at around 60K miles, we can't wait to get rid of it.
>>
>> I have a '97 Contour with over 140k mi on it. It still runs and handles
>> great. Great long-term quality.
>>
>> I have heard similar things about other Fords, Toyotas, Chevys, Hondas,
>> etc.
>>
>> They all make good cars that last a long time.
>>
>> Just what models did your wife get?
>>
>> Jeff
>

 

Jeff wrote:
>
> "Wade" <nugr**v*@excite.com> wrote in message
> news:YIqdnaG7s-5JIqHbnZ2dnUVZ_oKnnZ2d@comcast.com...
>> Let's see if I can remember them all
>> Jeep Cherokee - The worst.
>
> My uncle had a Jeep Cherokee that went over 200,000 mi without problems
> or even replacing the brake pads. It was kind of cold in the winter
> though. Needed a new thermostat.
>
>> This thing was in the shop ever few months.
>> brake, transmission and axel problems. She went over some train tracks
>> once, not hard mind you and the steering wheel became off center. The
>> steering wheel always look like she was turning left even when she was
>> driving straight. This happened twice.
>>
>> Ford Escape - great for the first 35K, then got noisy and the
>> transmission
>> started slipping.
>>
>> Dodge Grand Caravan - was okay
>>
>> Ford Windstar ***** and parts started falling off within the first few
>> thousand miles. We only had this car for about 20K, she then changed
>> jobs.
>>
>> Pontiac Grand Prix was okay, then developed a a clicking in the steering
>> wheel. The steering wasn't smooth, you could feel while turning.
>>
>> Chevrolet Equinox- only had this one for 8K, job change again. Was fairly
>> nice vehicle. Ride was way too soft though, felt like we were floating.
>
> Likewise, you're going to find people who have had excellent service
> from these vehicles and others who didn't. Likewise for the Toyotas and
> Hondas.
>
> Jeff
>

Also, company cars get the snot beat out of them. They never last. My
last company car, a Taurus, had to be traded in at 220,000 mi. ("it
might start getting unreliable" they said).

My current company car, another Taurus, is at 189,00 mi. now, & they'll
probably make me turn in that one too at ~220,000 mi. next year.

Bastards. They should buy some quality vehicles that last next time.

Rob








>> "Jeff" <news@googlemail.com> wrote in message
>> news:T%1%h.176$HR1.174@trnddc01...
>>>
>>> "Wade" <nugr**v*@excite.com> wrote in message
>>> news:bvadnezc3JJZBaHbnZ2dnUVZ_hOdnZ2d@comcast.com. ..
>>>> My problem with American cars is not with design. Some of them look
>>>> quite nice. It's the long term quality of the car. My wife gets a
>>>> new company car every couple of years. The are usually great for the
>>>> 30K miles or so. Around 35 to 40K they start have little issues,
>>>> they seem to get louder and the ride is a noticeably rougher. On a
>>>> couple of the vehicles you could feel the transmission start to
>>>> slip. By the time she turns it in at around 60K miles, we can't wait
>>>> to get rid of it.
>>>
>>> I have a '97 Contour with over 140k mi on it. It still runs and
>>> handles great. Great long-term quality.
>>>
>>> I have heard similar things about other Fords, Toyotas, Chevys,
>>> Hondas, etc.
>>>
>>> They all make good cars that last a long time.
>>>
>>> Just what models did your wife get?
>>>
>>> Jeff
>>
>

 

Jeff wrote:
>
> "Wade" <nugr**v*@excite.com> wrote in message
> news:YIqdnaG7s-5JIqHbnZ2dnUVZ_oKnnZ2d@comcast.com...
>> Let's see if I can remember them all
>> Jeep Cherokee - The worst.
>
> My uncle had a Jeep Cherokee that went over 200,000 mi without problems
> or even replacing the brake pads. It was kind of cold in the winter
> though. Needed a new thermostat.
>
>> This thing was in the shop ever few months.
>> brake, transmission and axel problems. She went over some train tracks
>> once, not hard mind you and the steering wheel became off center. The
>> steering wheel always look like she was turning left even when she was
>> driving straight. This happened twice.
>>
>> Ford Escape - great for the first 35K, then got noisy and the
>> transmission
>> started slipping.
>>
>> Dodge Grand Caravan - was okay
>>
>> Ford Windstar ***** and parts started falling off within the first few
>> thousand miles. We only had this car for about 20K, she then changed
>> jobs.
>>
>> Pontiac Grand Prix was okay, then developed a a clicking in the steering
>> wheel. The steering wasn't smooth, you could feel while turning.
>>
>> Chevrolet Equinox- only had this one for 8K, job change again. Was fairly
>> nice vehicle. Ride was way too soft though, felt like we were floating.
>
> Likewise, you're going to find people who have had excellent service
> from these vehicles and others who didn't. Likewise for the Toyotas and
> Hondas.
>
> Jeff
>

Also, company cars get the snot beat out of them. They never last. My
last company car, a Taurus, had to be traded in at 220,000 mi. ("it
might start getting unreliable" they said).

My current company car, another Taurus, is at 189,00 mi. now, & they'll
probably make me turn in that one too at ~220,000 mi. next year.

Bastards. They should buy some quality vehicles that last next time.

Rob








>> "Jeff" <news@googlemail.com> wrote in message
>> news:T%1%h.176$HR1.174@trnddc01...
>>>
>>> "Wade" <nugr**v*@excite.com> wrote in message
>>> news:bvadnezc3JJZBaHbnZ2dnUVZ_hOdnZ2d@comcast.com. ..
>>>> My problem with American cars is not with design. Some of them look
>>>> quite nice. It's the long term quality of the car. My wife gets a
>>>> new company car every couple of years. The are usually great for the
>>>> 30K miles or so. Around 35 to 40K they start have little issues,
>>>> they seem to get louder and the ride is a noticeably rougher. On a
>>>> couple of the vehicles you could feel the transmission start to
>>>> slip. By the time she turns it in at around 60K miles, we can't wait
>>>> to get rid of it.
>>>
>>> I have a '97 Contour with over 140k mi on it. It still runs and
>>> handles great. Great long-term quality.
>>>
>>> I have heard similar things about other Fords, Toyotas, Chevys,
>>> Hondas, etc.
>>>
>>> They all make good cars that last a long time.
>>>
>>> Just what models did your wife get?
>>>
>>> Jeff
>>
>

 

Whatever. I'm going by personal experience.
We've owned lots of other cars. The only foreign car that we had a major
problem with was an old Audi Fox.
4 Acura's Only 1 problem with the Legend after a major accident. Insurance
company insisted on using aftermarket parts for the repair.
1 Mercedes airbag problem which Mercedes fixed for free even though the car
was out of warranty.
2 Mazda's no problems
3 Volvos no problems
6 Hondas no problems
1 Isuzu no problems
1 Mitsubishi no problems
1 Nissan no problems

The only reason any of theses cars were traded in was because we wanted to.
All, except for the 2 Volvos had more miles than any of the American cars we
had.

"Jeff" <news@googlemail.com> wrote in message
news:5n3%h.2237$Q96.481@trnddc04...
>
> "Wade" <nugr**v*@excite.com> wrote in message
> news:YIqdnaG7s-5JIqHbnZ2dnUVZ_oKnnZ2d@comcast.com...
>> Let's see if I can remember them all
>> Jeep Cherokee - The worst.
>
> My uncle had a Jeep Cherokee that went over 200,000 mi without problems or
> even replacing the brake pads. It was kind of cold in the winter though.
> Needed a new thermostat.
>
>>This thing was in the shop ever few months.
>> brake, transmission and axel problems. She went over some train tracks
>> once, not hard mind you and the steering wheel became off center. The
>> steering wheel always look like she was turning left even when she was
>> driving straight. This happened twice.
>>
>> Ford Escape - great for the first 35K, then got noisy and the
>> transmission
>> started slipping.
>>
>> Dodge Grand Caravan - was okay
>>
>> Ford Windstar ***** and parts started falling off within the first few
>> thousand miles. We only had this car for about 20K, she then changed
>> jobs.
>>
>> Pontiac Grand Prix was okay, then developed a a clicking in the steering
>> wheel. The steering wasn't smooth, you could feel while turning.
>>
>> Chevrolet Equinox- only had this one for 8K, job change again. Was fairly
>> nice vehicle. Ride was way too soft though, felt like we were floating.
>
> Likewise, you're going to find people who have had excellent service from
> these vehicles and others who didn't. Likewise for the Toyotas and Hondas.
>
> Jeff
>
>> "Jeff" <news@googlemail.com> wrote in message
>> news:T%1%h.176$HR1.174@trnddc01...
>>>
>>> "Wade" <nugr**v*@excite.com> wrote in message
>>> news:bvadnezc3JJZBaHbnZ2dnUVZ_hOdnZ2d@comcast.com. ..
>>>> My problem with American cars is not with design. Some of them look
>>>> quite nice. It's the long term quality of the car. My wife gets a new
>>>> company car every couple of years. The are usually great for the 30K
>>>> miles or so. Around 35 to 40K they start have little issues, they seem
>>>> to get louder and the ride is a noticeably rougher. On a couple of the
>>>> vehicles you could feel the transmission start to slip. By the time she
>>>> turns it in at around 60K miles, we can't wait to get rid of it.
>>>
>>> I have a '97 Contour with over 140k mi on it. It still runs and handles
>>> great. Great long-term quality.
>>>
>>> I have heard similar things about other Fords, Toyotas, Chevys, Hondas,
>>> etc.
>>>
>>> They all make good cars that last a long time.
>>>
>>> Just what models did your wife get?
>>>
>>> Jeff
>>
>

 

Whatever. I'm going by personal experience.
We've owned lots of other cars. The only foreign car that we had a major
problem with was an old Audi Fox.
4 Acura's Only 1 problem with the Legend after a major accident. Insurance
company insisted on using aftermarket parts for the repair.
1 Mercedes airbag problem which Mercedes fixed for free even though the car
was out of warranty.
2 Mazda's no problems
3 Volvos no problems
6 Hondas no problems
1 Isuzu no problems
1 Mitsubishi no problems
1 Nissan no problems

The only reason any of theses cars were traded in was because we wanted to.
All, except for the 2 Volvos had more miles than any of the American cars we
had.

"Jeff" <news@googlemail.com> wrote in message
news:5n3%h.2237$Q96.481@trnddc04...
>
> "Wade" <nugr**v*@excite.com> wrote in message
> news:YIqdnaG7s-5JIqHbnZ2dnUVZ_oKnnZ2d@comcast.com...
>> Let's see if I can remember them all
>> Jeep Cherokee - The worst.
>
> My uncle had a Jeep Cherokee that went over 200,000 mi without problems or
> even replacing the brake pads. It was kind of cold in the winter though.
> Needed a new thermostat.
>
>>This thing was in the shop ever few months.
>> brake, transmission and axel problems. She went over some train tracks
>> once, not hard mind you and the steering wheel became off center. The
>> steering wheel always look like she was turning left even when she was
>> driving straight. This happened twice.
>>
>> Ford Escape - great for the first 35K, then got noisy and the
>> transmission
>> started slipping.
>>
>> Dodge Grand Caravan - was okay
>>
>> Ford Windstar ***** and parts started falling off within the first few
>> thousand miles. We only had this car for about 20K, she then changed
>> jobs.
>>
>> Pontiac Grand Prix was okay, then developed a a clicking in the steering
>> wheel. The steering wasn't smooth, you could feel while turning.
>>
>> Chevrolet Equinox- only had this one for 8K, job change again. Was fairly
>> nice vehicle. Ride was way too soft though, felt like we were floating.
>
> Likewise, you're going to find people who have had excellent service from
> these vehicles and others who didn't. Likewise for the Toyotas and Hondas.
>
> Jeff
>
>> "Jeff" <news@googlemail.com> wrote in message
>> news:T%1%h.176$HR1.174@trnddc01...
>>>
>>> "Wade" <nugr**v*@excite.com> wrote in message
>>> news:bvadnezc3JJZBaHbnZ2dnUVZ_hOdnZ2d@comcast.com. ..
>>>> My problem with American cars is not with design. Some of them look
>>>> quite nice. It's the long term quality of the car. My wife gets a new
>>>> company car every couple of years. The are usually great for the 30K
>>>> miles or so. Around 35 to 40K they start have little issues, they seem
>>>> to get louder and the ride is a noticeably rougher. On a couple of the
>>>> vehicles you could feel the transmission start to slip. By the time she
>>>> turns it in at around 60K miles, we can't wait to get rid of it.
>>>
>>> I have a '97 Contour with over 140k mi on it. It still runs and handles
>>> great. Great long-term quality.
>>>
>>> I have heard similar things about other Fords, Toyotas, Chevys, Hondas,
>>> etc.
>>>
>>> They all make good cars that last a long time.
>>>
>>> Just what models did your wife get?
>>>
>>> Jeff
>>
>

 

On Sat, 5 May 2007 07:46:16 -0700, "Wade" <nugr**v*@excite.com> wrote:

>My problem with American cars is not with design. Some of them look quite
>nice. It's the long term quality of the car. My wife gets a new company car
>every couple of years. The are usually great for the 30K miles or so. Around
>35 to 40K they start have little issues, they seem to get louder and the
>ride is a noticeably rougher. On a couple of the vehicles you could feel the
>transmission start to slip. By the time she turns it in at around 60K miles,
>we can't wait to get rid of it.
>

Maybe so, yet we run hundreds of "American" cars in our fleet and this
just never happens. Most run way past 100K.


><bigjim@backpacker.com> wrote in message
>news:1178363902.949444.319780@n76g2000hsh.googleg roups.com...
>>I agree. I stopped to look at the Sport Trac. Looks fone from
>> outside, decent price/features etc. The interior was just AWFUL!!!
>> The door handles are awkward and unintuitive. Dash is trying to be
>> "modern german spartan design" but is ugly. Ford wonders why they are
>> failing? Instead of giving money to homosexual groups they should
>> hire real designers and pay some average people for design ideas.
>> Quality also needs to be addressed but the big problem is UGLY. Who
>> will buy the Edge- urban homosexuals seem to be the target .
>>
>>
>> On May 3, 12:50 am, Ashton Crusher <d...@moore.net> wrote:
>>> On Tue, 1 May 2007 21:40:06 +0200 (CEST), Nomen Nescio
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> <Use-Author-Supplied-Address-Header@[127.1]> wrote:
>>> >Wall St Journal - May 1, 2007
>>>
>>> >Barry Engle, Ford's new North American marketing chief, acknowledged
>>> >that companies usually avoid giving free advertising to rivals. But he
>>> >said the challenge ads are meant to "provoke people to try our products
>>> >and making sure we are on the list." Mr. Engle also said Ford needs to
>>> >face the fact that consumers are pitting the company's vehicles against
>>> >those from Honda Motor Co. and Toyota when choosing what to buy. As a
>>> >result, he aimed at giving Ford's marketing a more confident tone.
>>>
>>> >.the Ford Challenge advertising campaign...asks consumers to compare
>>> >Ford vehicles to their toughest competitors. The first television,
>>> >print and online ads, launched at the beginning of this year, focused
>>> >on the Ford Fusion midsize sedanhttp://doiop.com/Fusion- The
>>> >commercials showed consumers comparing the Fusion favorably against a
>>> >Toyota Camry and a Honda Accord, both of which were mentioned by name.
>>>
>>> >Honda spokesman Sage Marie said the Ford ad serves as validation that
>>> >the Accord is a benchmark for the segment. Toyota spokesman Bill Kwong
>>> >said Ford wasn't making an "apples to apples" comparison because the ad
>>> >features an all-wheel-drive Fusion compared with a front-wheel-drive
>>> >Camry.
>>>
>>> >At first, the Fusion got what Ford insiders call the "launch and
>>> >abandon" treatment, as ads for the car largely disappeared several
>>> >months after the vehicle hit showrooms after its October 2005 launch.
>>> >Mr. Engle found that at the end of 2006, two-thirds of consumers
>>> >weren't aware the Fusion existed. "In the past, we gravitated
>>> >disproportionately on our new stuff."
>>>
>>> >But after Ford renewed its push on the Fusion with the Ford Challenge
>>> >ads this year, Fusion sales accelerated, up by almost 33% in 2007
>>> >through March over a year earlier.
>>>
>>> >Engle is using some of the lessons he learned as president of Ford
>>> >Brazil. Five years ago, Ford faced product and marketing-strategy
>>> >problems there similar to those it faces now in the U.S. When Mr. Engle
>>> >took over the marketing position in North America, he realized there
>>> >was a lot more the marketing team could do with the Fusion, which was
>>> >the market leader in South America.
>>>
>>> >Mr. Engle's next high-profile project will be this summer's relaunch of
>>> >the sedan formerly known as the Ford Five Hundred
>>> >http://doiop.com/Ford_500which will be renamed the Taurus. Mr. Engle
>>> >declined to discuss the campaign details because it was too early, but
>>> >he did say the Five Hundred was another great product that suffered
>>> >from lack of awareness and appreciation.
>>>
>>> I think one of Fords (and Chevy's) problems is that their car designs
>>> suck. Every time I see a Fusion, or Milan, or the new Lincoln, etc on
>>> the road I am struck by how ugly they are. Pretty much the same for
>>> most of the Chevy's.
>>>
>>> By contrast, look at the Nissan Altima. It's just a basic mid level
>>> car but it looks NICE and they have made it look like QUALITY thru the
>>> choices of materials and other design features. On some of the
>>> Chevy's one of the things that often catches my eye is how things like
>>> the parking lot rub strip doesn't even seem like it was glued on
>>> straight. And don't get me started on the huge amount of cheap
>>> plastic they glue to every Pontiac that comes down the assembly line.-
>>> Hide quoted text -
>>>
>>> - Show quoted text -
>>
>>

 

On Sat, 5 May 2007 07:46:16 -0700, "Wade" <nugr**v*@excite.com> wrote:

>My problem with American cars is not with design. Some of them look quite
>nice. It's the long term quality of the car. My wife gets a new company car
>every couple of years. The are usually great for the 30K miles or so. Around
>35 to 40K they start have little issues, they seem to get louder and the
>ride is a noticeably rougher. On a couple of the vehicles you could feel the
>transmission start to slip. By the time she turns it in at around 60K miles,
>we can't wait to get rid of it.
>

Maybe so, yet we run hundreds of "American" cars in our fleet and this
just never happens. Most run way past 100K.


><bigjim@backpacker.com> wrote in message
>news:1178363902.949444.319780@n76g2000hsh.googleg roups.com...
>>I agree. I stopped to look at the Sport Trac. Looks fone from
>> outside, decent price/features etc. The interior was just AWFUL!!!
>> The door handles are awkward and unintuitive. Dash is trying to be
>> "modern german spartan design" but is ugly. Ford wonders why they are
>> failing? Instead of giving money to homosexual groups they should
>> hire real designers and pay some average people for design ideas.
>> Quality also needs to be addressed but the big problem is UGLY. Who
>> will buy the Edge- urban homosexuals seem to be the target .
>>
>>
>> On May 3, 12:50 am, Ashton Crusher <d...@moore.net> wrote:
>>> On Tue, 1 May 2007 21:40:06 +0200 (CEST), Nomen Nescio
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> <Use-Author-Supplied-Address-Header@[127.1]> wrote:
>>> >Wall St Journal - May 1, 2007
>>>
>>> >Barry Engle, Ford's new North American marketing chief, acknowledged
>>> >that companies usually avoid giving free advertising to rivals. But he
>>> >said the challenge ads are meant to "provoke people to try our products
>>> >and making sure we are on the list." Mr. Engle also said Ford needs to
>>> >face the fact that consumers are pitting the company's vehicles against
>>> >those from Honda Motor Co. and Toyota when choosing what to buy. As a
>>> >result, he aimed at giving Ford's marketing a more confident tone.
>>>
>>> >.the Ford Challenge advertising campaign...asks consumers to compare
>>> >Ford vehicles to their toughest competitors. The first television,
>>> >print and online ads, launched at the beginning of this year, focused
>>> >on the Ford Fusion midsize sedanhttp://doiop.com/Fusion- The
>>> >commercials showed consumers comparing the Fusion favorably against a
>>> >Toyota Camry and a Honda Accord, both of which were mentioned by name.
>>>
>>> >Honda spokesman Sage Marie said the Ford ad serves as validation that
>>> >the Accord is a benchmark for the segment. Toyota spokesman Bill Kwong
>>> >said Ford wasn't making an "apples to apples" comparison because the ad
>>> >features an all-wheel-drive Fusion compared with a front-wheel-drive
>>> >Camry.
>>>
>>> >At first, the Fusion got what Ford insiders call the "launch and
>>> >abandon" treatment, as ads for the car largely disappeared several
>>> >months after the vehicle hit showrooms after its October 2005 launch.
>>> >Mr. Engle found that at the end of 2006, two-thirds of consumers
>>> >weren't aware the Fusion existed. "In the past, we gravitated
>>> >disproportionately on our new stuff."
>>>
>>> >But after Ford renewed its push on the Fusion with the Ford Challenge
>>> >ads this year, Fusion sales accelerated, up by almost 33% in 2007
>>> >through March over a year earlier.
>>>
>>> >Engle is using some of the lessons he learned as president of Ford
>>> >Brazil. Five years ago, Ford faced product and marketing-strategy
>>> >problems there similar to those it faces now in the U.S. When Mr. Engle
>>> >took over the marketing position in North America, he realized there
>>> >was a lot more the marketing team could do with the Fusion, which was
>>> >the market leader in South America.
>>>
>>> >Mr. Engle's next high-profile project will be this summer's relaunch of
>>> >the sedan formerly known as the Ford Five Hundred
>>> >http://doiop.com/Ford_500which will be renamed the Taurus. Mr. Engle
>>> >declined to discuss the campaign details because it was too early, but
>>> >he did say the Five Hundred was another great product that suffered
>>> >from lack of awareness and appreciation.
>>>
>>> I think one of Fords (and Chevy's) problems is that their car designs
>>> suck. Every time I see a Fusion, or Milan, or the new Lincoln, etc on
>>> the road I am struck by how ugly they are. Pretty much the same for
>>> most of the Chevy's.
>>>
>>> By contrast, look at the Nissan Altima. It's just a basic mid level
>>> car but it looks NICE and they have made it look like QUALITY thru the
>>> choices of materials and other design features. On some of the
>>> Chevy's one of the things that often catches my eye is how things like
>>> the parking lot rub strip doesn't even seem like it was glued on
>>> straight. And don't get me started on the huge amount of cheap
>>> plastic they glue to every Pontiac that comes down the assembly line.-
>>> Hide quoted text -
>>>
>>> - Show quoted text -
>>
>>