If you really want to have data on your oil, and know when what intervals
work for YOU. Have the oil analyzed. You will find a great deal about how
your engine is wearing and how the oil is holding up.
I recommend http://www.blackstone-labs.com/ they have done good work for
me. It helps to have actual data to assist in making choices about car care.

Regards,
Mark

 

If you really want to have data on your oil, and know when what intervals
work for YOU. Have the oil analyzed. You will find a great deal about how
your engine is wearing and how the oil is holding up.
I recommend http://www.blackstone-labs.com/ they have done good work for
me. It helps to have actual data to assist in making choices about car care.

Regards,
Mark

 

Oil changes depend on several things. The conditions where you drive (hot or
cold, damp or dry) The type of driving you do (short trips, stop and go or long
trips), the condition of the engine and the type of oil used. I have worked for
a company for 25 years which has service vehicles who's maintenance frequency
is determined by the assigned drivers. Although I do not see anymore engine
failures in vehicles with 3K oil changes then with 7k+ oil changes up to about
80K miles, the vehicles which have longer oil change intervals do not seem to
have that original new car power the ones which get the 3K oil changes seem to
have. Also, the ones which had long oil change intervals have more problems with
throttle bodies clogging and egr failures. When you look in the oil filler hole
in the valve cover, you can see sludge and heavy brown glaze on everything in
the 7K+ oil change interval cars. The 3K change interval cars have nice clean
camshafts and valve springs and do not have problems with the EGR or throttle
body. The bottom line is that cars in our fleet which were not seeing 3K oil
changes obviously had a bit more engine wear and although they still ran, they
did not run as good. If you are going to trade the car before 100K, by all
means, let it go to 7.5K and a filter every other oil change. But if you want
this car to perform like new for over 100K, bite the bullit and change that oil
at around 3 - 4K with a filter. My rule of thumb is that if I can not easily see
the line on the dipstick through the oil, it is too dark and too contaminated
with the byproducts of combustion and needs to be changed. Unless there is
something wrong with the engine, this should happen around 4K miles. Oh, this is
with good quality standard oils. Some synthetics will hold up a bit better.

 

Oil changes depend on several things. The conditions where you drive (hot or
cold, damp or dry) The type of driving you do (short trips, stop and go or long
trips), the condition of the engine and the type of oil used. I have worked for
a company for 25 years which has service vehicles who's maintenance frequency
is determined by the assigned drivers. Although I do not see anymore engine
failures in vehicles with 3K oil changes then with 7k+ oil changes up to about
80K miles, the vehicles which have longer oil change intervals do not seem to
have that original new car power the ones which get the 3K oil changes seem to
have. Also, the ones which had long oil change intervals have more problems with
throttle bodies clogging and egr failures. When you look in the oil filler hole
in the valve cover, you can see sludge and heavy brown glaze on everything in
the 7K+ oil change interval cars. The 3K change interval cars have nice clean
camshafts and valve springs and do not have problems with the EGR or throttle
body. The bottom line is that cars in our fleet which were not seeing 3K oil
changes obviously had a bit more engine wear and although they still ran, they
did not run as good. If you are going to trade the car before 100K, by all
means, let it go to 7.5K and a filter every other oil change. But if you want
this car to perform like new for over 100K, bite the bullit and change that oil
at around 3 - 4K with a filter. My rule of thumb is that if I can not easily see
the line on the dipstick through the oil, it is too dark and too contaminated
with the byproducts of combustion and needs to be changed. Unless there is
something wrong with the engine, this should happen around 4K miles. Oh, this is
with good quality standard oils. Some synthetics will hold up a bit better.

 

Oil changes depend on several things. The conditions where you drive (hot or
cold, damp or dry) The type of driving you do (short trips, stop and go or long
trips), the condition of the engine and the type of oil used. I have worked for
a company for 25 years which has service vehicles who's maintenance frequency
is determined by the assigned drivers. Although I do not see anymore engine
failures in vehicles with 3K oil changes then with 7k+ oil changes up to about
80K miles, the vehicles which have longer oil change intervals do not seem to
have that original new car power the ones which get the 3K oil changes seem to
have. Also, the ones which had long oil change intervals have more problems with
throttle bodies clogging and egr failures. When you look in the oil filler hole
in the valve cover, you can see sludge and heavy brown glaze on everything in
the 7K+ oil change interval cars. The 3K change interval cars have nice clean
camshafts and valve springs and do not have problems with the EGR or throttle
body. The bottom line is that cars in our fleet which were not seeing 3K oil
changes obviously had a bit more engine wear and although they still ran, they
did not run as good. If you are going to trade the car before 100K, by all
means, let it go to 7.5K and a filter every other oil change. But if you want
this car to perform like new for over 100K, bite the bullit and change that oil
at around 3 - 4K with a filter. My rule of thumb is that if I can not easily see
the line on the dipstick through the oil, it is too dark and too contaminated
with the byproducts of combustion and needs to be changed. Unless there is
something wrong with the engine, this should happen around 4K miles. Oh, this is
with good quality standard oils. Some synthetics will hold up a bit better.

 

wdb <wbittle1@alltel.com> wrote in message news:<3F6A30E2.283CA68C@alltel.com>...
> Oil changes depend on several things. The conditions where you drive (hot or
> cold, damp or dry) The type of driving you do (short trips, stop and go or long
> trips), the condition of the engine and the type of oil used. I have worked for
> a company for 25 years which has service vehicles who's maintenance frequency
> is determined by the assigned drivers. Although I do not see anymore engine
> failures in vehicles with 3K oil changes then with 7k+ oil changes up to about
> 80K miles, the vehicles which have longer oil change intervals do not seem to
> have that original new car power the ones which get the 3K oil changes seem to
> have. Also, the ones which had long oil change intervals have more problems with
> throttle bodies clogging and egr failures. When you look in the oil filler hole
> in the valve cover, you can see sludge and heavy brown glaze on everything in
> the 7K+ oil change interval cars. The 3K change interval cars have nice clean
> camshafts and valve springs and do not have problems with the EGR or throttle
> body. The bottom line is that cars in our fleet which were not seeing 3K oil
> changes obviously had a bit more engine wear and although they still ran, they
> did not run as good. If you are going to trade the car before 100K, by all
> means, let it go to 7.5K and a filter every other oil change. But if you want
> this car to perform like new for over 100K, bite the bullit and change that oil
> at around 3 - 4K with a filter. My rule of thumb is that if I can not easily see
> the line on the dipstick through the oil, it is too dark and too contaminated
> with the byproducts of combustion and needs to be changed. Unless there is
> something wrong with the engine, this should happen around 4K miles. Oh, this is
> with good quality standard oils. Some synthetics will hold up a bit better.


I to own a 2003 Honda Accord EX-L I also had the problem of when to
change the oil.
I was always brought up to change oil @ 3000 miles. so to make a long
story short I
settled on 5000 mile oil change.it's easy to remember and it's half
way between 3&7500
I came to this conclusion after reading a post from another Google
member about the same
dilemma,He (the poster) was a mechanical engineer He had sent oil to
the lad @3000&5000
and saw no difference in breakdown. Color of oil does not matter. The
next time you go to get
oil look @ the oil itself you will see some oil's start out dark and
some clear (I like the clear oil)
so that shoots that theory of dark?
oil change it! do what you feel comfortable with but in my opinion
5,000 is just about right. just use a good brand of oil and oil
filter.

 

wdb <wbittle1@alltel.com> wrote in message news:<3F6A30E2.283CA68C@alltel.com>...
> Oil changes depend on several things. The conditions where you drive (hot or
> cold, damp or dry) The type of driving you do (short trips, stop and go or long
> trips), the condition of the engine and the type of oil used. I have worked for
> a company for 25 years which has service vehicles who's maintenance frequency
> is determined by the assigned drivers. Although I do not see anymore engine
> failures in vehicles with 3K oil changes then with 7k+ oil changes up to about
> 80K miles, the vehicles which have longer oil change intervals do not seem to
> have that original new car power the ones which get the 3K oil changes seem to
> have. Also, the ones which had long oil change intervals have more problems with
> throttle bodies clogging and egr failures. When you look in the oil filler hole
> in the valve cover, you can see sludge and heavy brown glaze on everything in
> the 7K+ oil change interval cars. The 3K change interval cars have nice clean
> camshafts and valve springs and do not have problems with the EGR or throttle
> body. The bottom line is that cars in our fleet which were not seeing 3K oil
> changes obviously had a bit more engine wear and although they still ran, they
> did not run as good. If you are going to trade the car before 100K, by all
> means, let it go to 7.5K and a filter every other oil change. But if you want
> this car to perform like new for over 100K, bite the bullit and change that oil
> at around 3 - 4K with a filter. My rule of thumb is that if I can not easily see
> the line on the dipstick through the oil, it is too dark and too contaminated
> with the byproducts of combustion and needs to be changed. Unless there is
> something wrong with the engine, this should happen around 4K miles. Oh, this is
> with good quality standard oils. Some synthetics will hold up a bit better.


I to own a 2003 Honda Accord EX-L I also had the problem of when to
change the oil.
I was always brought up to change oil @ 3000 miles. so to make a long
story short I
settled on 5000 mile oil change.it's easy to remember and it's half
way between 3&7500
I came to this conclusion after reading a post from another Google
member about the same
dilemma,He (the poster) was a mechanical engineer He had sent oil to
the lad @3000&5000
and saw no difference in breakdown. Color of oil does not matter. The
next time you go to get
oil look @ the oil itself you will see some oil's start out dark and
some clear (I like the clear oil)
so that shoots that theory of dark?
oil change it! do what you feel comfortable with but in my opinion
5,000 is just about right. just use a good brand of oil and oil
filter.

 

wdb <wbittle1@alltel.com> wrote in message news:<3F6A30E2.283CA68C@alltel.com>...
> Oil changes depend on several things. The conditions where you drive (hot or
> cold, damp or dry) The type of driving you do (short trips, stop and go or long
> trips), the condition of the engine and the type of oil used. I have worked for
> a company for 25 years which has service vehicles who's maintenance frequency
> is determined by the assigned drivers. Although I do not see anymore engine
> failures in vehicles with 3K oil changes then with 7k+ oil changes up to about
> 80K miles, the vehicles which have longer oil change intervals do not seem to
> have that original new car power the ones which get the 3K oil changes seem to
> have. Also, the ones which had long oil change intervals have more problems with
> throttle bodies clogging and egr failures. When you look in the oil filler hole
> in the valve cover, you can see sludge and heavy brown glaze on everything in
> the 7K+ oil change interval cars. The 3K change interval cars have nice clean
> camshafts and valve springs and do not have problems with the EGR or throttle
> body. The bottom line is that cars in our fleet which were not seeing 3K oil
> changes obviously had a bit more engine wear and although they still ran, they
> did not run as good. If you are going to trade the car before 100K, by all
> means, let it go to 7.5K and a filter every other oil change. But if you want
> this car to perform like new for over 100K, bite the bullit and change that oil
> at around 3 - 4K with a filter. My rule of thumb is that if I can not easily see
> the line on the dipstick through the oil, it is too dark and too contaminated
> with the byproducts of combustion and needs to be changed. Unless there is
> something wrong with the engine, this should happen around 4K miles. Oh, this is
> with good quality standard oils. Some synthetics will hold up a bit better.


I to own a 2003 Honda Accord EX-L I also had the problem of when to
change the oil.
I was always brought up to change oil @ 3000 miles. so to make a long
story short I
settled on 5000 mile oil change.it's easy to remember and it's half
way between 3&7500
I came to this conclusion after reading a post from another Google
member about the same
dilemma,He (the poster) was a mechanical engineer He had sent oil to
the lad @3000&5000
and saw no difference in breakdown. Color of oil does not matter. The
next time you go to get
oil look @ the oil itself you will see some oil's start out dark and
some clear (I like the clear oil)
so that shoots that theory of dark?
oil change it! do what you feel comfortable with but in my opinion
5,000 is just about right. just use a good brand of oil and oil
filter.

 

On Thu, 18 Sep 2003 18:25:38 -0400, wdb <wbittle1@alltel.com> wrote:
>
>Oil changes depend on several things. The conditions where you drive (hot or
>cold, damp or dry) The type of driving you do (short trips, stop and go or long
>trips), the condition of the engine and the type of oil used. I have worked for
>a company for 25 years which has service vehicles who's maintenance frequency
>is determined by the assigned drivers. Although I do not see anymore engine
>failures in vehicles with 3K oil changes then with 7k+ oil changes up to about
>80K miles, the vehicles which have longer oil change intervals do not seem to
>have that original new car power the ones which get the 3K oil changes seem to
>have. Also, the ones which had long oil change intervals have more problems with
>throttle bodies clogging and egr failures. When you look in the oil filler hole
>in the valve cover, you can see sludge and heavy brown glaze on everything in
>the 7K+ oil change interval cars. The 3K change interval cars have nice clean
>camshafts and valve springs and do not have problems with the EGR or throttle
>body. The bottom line is that cars in our fleet which were not seeing 3K oil
>changes obviously had a bit more engine wear and although they still ran, they
>did not run as good. If you are going to trade the car before 100K, by all
>means, let it go to 7.5K and a filter every other oil change. But if you want
>this car to perform like new for over 100K, bite the bullit and change that oil
>at around 3 - 4K with a filter. My rule of thumb is that if I can not easily see
>the line on the dipstick through the oil, it is too dark and too contaminated
>with the byproducts of combustion and needs to be changed. Unless there is
>something wrong with the engine, this should happen around 4K miles. Oh, this is
>with good quality standard oils. Some synthetics will hold up a bit better.
>
I missed the original postings, but I note in the subject that the
original topic was FIRST oil change. My understanding is that you
should wait the full period called for in the maintenance schedule as
there is a special break-in oil in the car.

After that, I think it is all a combination of speculation combined
with hype from the oil change industry. Many years ago (and I realize
that oil chemistry has evolved) an oil engineer told me that it is the
filter, not the oil that is the critical change element. That's kind
of backward to what I read in the Honda maintenance that suggests
changing the filter only every other oil change. This engineer said
that much of the varnish type deposits come from new oil in the first
few thousand miles and that changing too frequently simply adds more
deposits without any real benefit since the oil would be still just
fine. Of course that's just one expert's opinion and some years back.

I have heard numerous times that lab analysis of oil shows that it
holds up very well over much longer periods than the 3K or even 5K
intervals would suggest. Of course it certainly isn't in the interest
of the oil companies or oil change industry to promote that. I've
never heard any reason for the "standard" 3K interval other than heavy
advertising / promotion by the industry that benefits most from short
interval changes.

 

On Thu, 18 Sep 2003 18:25:38 -0400, wdb <wbittle1@alltel.com> wrote:
>
>Oil changes depend on several things. The conditions where you drive (hot or
>cold, damp or dry) The type of driving you do (short trips, stop and go or long
>trips), the condition of the engine and the type of oil used. I have worked for
>a company for 25 years which has service vehicles who's maintenance frequency
>is determined by the assigned drivers. Although I do not see anymore engine
>failures in vehicles with 3K oil changes then with 7k+ oil changes up to about
>80K miles, the vehicles which have longer oil change intervals do not seem to
>have that original new car power the ones which get the 3K oil changes seem to
>have. Also, the ones which had long oil change intervals have more problems with
>throttle bodies clogging and egr failures. When you look in the oil filler hole
>in the valve cover, you can see sludge and heavy brown glaze on everything in
>the 7K+ oil change interval cars. The 3K change interval cars have nice clean
>camshafts and valve springs and do not have problems with the EGR or throttle
>body. The bottom line is that cars in our fleet which were not seeing 3K oil
>changes obviously had a bit more engine wear and although they still ran, they
>did not run as good. If you are going to trade the car before 100K, by all
>means, let it go to 7.5K and a filter every other oil change. But if you want
>this car to perform like new for over 100K, bite the bullit and change that oil
>at around 3 - 4K with a filter. My rule of thumb is that if I can not easily see
>the line on the dipstick through the oil, it is too dark and too contaminated
>with the byproducts of combustion and needs to be changed. Unless there is
>something wrong with the engine, this should happen around 4K miles. Oh, this is
>with good quality standard oils. Some synthetics will hold up a bit better.
>
I missed the original postings, but I note in the subject that the
original topic was FIRST oil change. My understanding is that you
should wait the full period called for in the maintenance schedule as
there is a special break-in oil in the car.

After that, I think it is all a combination of speculation combined
with hype from the oil change industry. Many years ago (and I realize
that oil chemistry has evolved) an oil engineer told me that it is the
filter, not the oil that is the critical change element. That's kind
of backward to what I read in the Honda maintenance that suggests
changing the filter only every other oil change. This engineer said
that much of the varnish type deposits come from new oil in the first
few thousand miles and that changing too frequently simply adds more
deposits without any real benefit since the oil would be still just
fine. Of course that's just one expert's opinion and some years back.

I have heard numerous times that lab analysis of oil shows that it
holds up very well over much longer periods than the 3K or even 5K
intervals would suggest. Of course it certainly isn't in the interest
of the oil companies or oil change industry to promote that. I've
never heard any reason for the "standard" 3K interval other than heavy
advertising / promotion by the industry that benefits most from short
interval changes.

 

On Thu, 18 Sep 2003 18:25:38 -0400, wdb <wbittle1@alltel.com> wrote:
>
>Oil changes depend on several things. The conditions where you drive (hot or
>cold, damp or dry) The type of driving you do (short trips, stop and go or long
>trips), the condition of the engine and the type of oil used. I have worked for
>a company for 25 years which has service vehicles who's maintenance frequency
>is determined by the assigned drivers. Although I do not see anymore engine
>failures in vehicles with 3K oil changes then with 7k+ oil changes up to about
>80K miles, the vehicles which have longer oil change intervals do not seem to
>have that original new car power the ones which get the 3K oil changes seem to
>have. Also, the ones which had long oil change intervals have more problems with
>throttle bodies clogging and egr failures. When you look in the oil filler hole
>in the valve cover, you can see sludge and heavy brown glaze on everything in
>the 7K+ oil change interval cars. The 3K change interval cars have nice clean
>camshafts and valve springs and do not have problems with the EGR or throttle
>body. The bottom line is that cars in our fleet which were not seeing 3K oil
>changes obviously had a bit more engine wear and although they still ran, they
>did not run as good. If you are going to trade the car before 100K, by all
>means, let it go to 7.5K and a filter every other oil change. But if you want
>this car to perform like new for over 100K, bite the bullit and change that oil
>at around 3 - 4K with a filter. My rule of thumb is that if I can not easily see
>the line on the dipstick through the oil, it is too dark and too contaminated
>with the byproducts of combustion and needs to be changed. Unless there is
>something wrong with the engine, this should happen around 4K miles. Oh, this is
>with good quality standard oils. Some synthetics will hold up a bit better.
>
I missed the original postings, but I note in the subject that the
original topic was FIRST oil change. My understanding is that you
should wait the full period called for in the maintenance schedule as
there is a special break-in oil in the car.

After that, I think it is all a combination of speculation combined
with hype from the oil change industry. Many years ago (and I realize
that oil chemistry has evolved) an oil engineer told me that it is the
filter, not the oil that is the critical change element. That's kind
of backward to what I read in the Honda maintenance that suggests
changing the filter only every other oil change. This engineer said
that much of the varnish type deposits come from new oil in the first
few thousand miles and that changing too frequently simply adds more
deposits without any real benefit since the oil would be still just
fine. Of course that's just one expert's opinion and some years back.

I have heard numerous times that lab analysis of oil shows that it
holds up very well over much longer periods than the 3K or even 5K
intervals would suggest. Of course it certainly isn't in the interest
of the oil companies or oil change industry to promote that. I've
never heard any reason for the "standard" 3K interval other than heavy
advertising / promotion by the industry that benefits most from short
interval changes.

 

In article <n8b0b.117859$_R5.41928226@news4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net >,
"Jim" <jkc84@optonline(unspam).net> wrote:

> A guy that writes an Auto Column in my local paper never lets a week go by
> that he doesn't harp that 3K oil changes are so important - more so in
> hotter running newer cars. He writes that his shop does 100 cars a week so
> he knows what he is talking about. Always brings up the Toyota fiasco of a
> few years back where they sludged up when changed at 7500 and no sludge when
> done at 3K. I won't read his column anymore....I thought he was on to
> something.

Hmmm...100 oil changes a week for drivers who change at 3000 miles at
$25 per oil change, minus $10 for all the supplies/hazmat handling/labor
costs minus $5 for facility costs times 52 weeks a year means $52,000 to
this guy's bottom line. (All numbers derived through rectal estimation,
or "I pulled 'em out of my ***.")

Now! If all his customers were changing oil every 6000 miles, he's only
doing $26,000 profit in oil changes.

Twenty-six grand may be chump change to a car dealer, but a little chump
change here and a little there and pretty soon you're dealing in real
money.

Oh yeah...I'm Jim. Tomorrow I pick up my 86 Accord.

--jmowreader

 

In article <n8b0b.117859$_R5.41928226@news4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net >,
"Jim" <jkc84@optonline(unspam).net> wrote:

> A guy that writes an Auto Column in my local paper never lets a week go by
> that he doesn't harp that 3K oil changes are so important - more so in
> hotter running newer cars. He writes that his shop does 100 cars a week so
> he knows what he is talking about. Always brings up the Toyota fiasco of a
> few years back where they sludged up when changed at 7500 and no sludge when
> done at 3K. I won't read his column anymore....I thought he was on to
> something.

Hmmm...100 oil changes a week for drivers who change at 3000 miles at
$25 per oil change, minus $10 for all the supplies/hazmat handling/labor
costs minus $5 for facility costs times 52 weeks a year means $52,000 to
this guy's bottom line. (All numbers derived through rectal estimation,
or "I pulled 'em out of my ***.")

Now! If all his customers were changing oil every 6000 miles, he's only
doing $26,000 profit in oil changes.

Twenty-six grand may be chump change to a car dealer, but a little chump
change here and a little there and pretty soon you're dealing in real
money.

Oh yeah...I'm Jim. Tomorrow I pick up my 86 Accord.

--jmowreader

 

In article <n8b0b.117859$_R5.41928226@news4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net >,
"Jim" <jkc84@optonline(unspam).net> wrote:

> A guy that writes an Auto Column in my local paper never lets a week go by
> that he doesn't harp that 3K oil changes are so important - more so in
> hotter running newer cars. He writes that his shop does 100 cars a week so
> he knows what he is talking about. Always brings up the Toyota fiasco of a
> few years back where they sludged up when changed at 7500 and no sludge when
> done at 3K. I won't read his column anymore....I thought he was on to
> something.

Hmmm...100 oil changes a week for drivers who change at 3000 miles at
$25 per oil change, minus $10 for all the supplies/hazmat handling/labor
costs minus $5 for facility costs times 52 weeks a year means $52,000 to
this guy's bottom line. (All numbers derived through rectal estimation,
or "I pulled 'em out of my ***.")

Now! If all his customers were changing oil every 6000 miles, he's only
doing $26,000 profit in oil changes.

Twenty-six grand may be chump change to a car dealer, but a little chump
change here and a little there and pretty soon you're dealing in real
money.

Oh yeah...I'm Jim. Tomorrow I pick up my 86 Accord.

--jmowreader

 

In article <i6F%a.90727$_R5.34812511@news4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> ,
Gus <GusPod@XXX.optonline.net> wrote:

> I've wondered about that, thinking the frequent oil changes were a
> throwback to when motor oils didn't contain detergents. Of course, it's
> in the interest of the oil companies & dealers to perpetuate that habit.

Nope, the 3000-mile interval came around in 1979, and it was for smog
control. I have no idea why, but cars with clean oil pollute less than
cars with dirty oil. (All the guys I know in California tell me they
always change the oil just before they're smogged, since their cars can
pass the sniffer test easier with fresh oil than with used.)

When the dealers were told "we're going to a 3000-mile change interval
on the oil," the almost unanimous response was "this is gonna kill us,
we can't hang with this." Fine, said Pennzoil, we'll take matters into
our own hands...and they started a little chain of stores that did
nothing but change oil really fast. You know them as "Jiffy Lube." (Now
Pennzoil belongs to Shell and so does Jiffy Lube.)

--jmowreader