94 civic overheating saga...continues
#16
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: 94 civic overheating saga...continues
That was replaced last November. Been good 'till now.
G-Man
"E. Meyer" <e.meyer0SPAM@ieee.org> wrote in message
news:BCA40BEF.66A0F%e.meyer0SPAM@ieee.org...
>
> Did this problem by any chance start right after the timing belt
> replacement? Timing could be off by one belt tooth & that would be enough
> to cause overheating.
>
> On 4/14/04 9:37 PM, in article 107rt6i8j2q9o29@news.supernews.com, "G-Man"
> <g_foreman@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > Yes, replaced the thermostat. Oil was dirty on the stick, but nothing
> > unusual. Water Pump replaced along with Timing Belt last November.
Only 3k
> > on it.
> >
> > G-Man
> >
> >
> > "Condor" <condorski@mindspring.com> wrote in message
> > news:5dlfc.7122$l75.2509@newsread2.news.atl.earthl ink.net...
> >> Can you tell if anti freeze is in the oil?
> >>
> >> It could be the water pump. a water pump can
> >> break without totally failing, seizing, or leaking.
> >> If the impellers are worn badly, the water does not
> >> go through good. i have had this happen on
> >> a mustang. when i took the water pump off my
> >> crx, it was still going, but man, it was worn inside
> >> almost to nothing.
> >> If it is your head, there should be white yuck in
> >> your oil. Obviously you already replaced the
> >> thermostat (?)
> >>
> >> "G-Man" <somebody@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> >> news:107lb5a2u64gg39@news.supernews.com...
> >>> Still overheating. They replaced radiator saying it was clogged.
Still
> >> no
> >>> joy.
> >>>
> >>> Now saying head gasket.
> >>>
> >>> Any guesses on what I'm looking at for a head gasket replacement?
> >>>
> >>> G-Man
> >>>
> >>>
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
>
G-Man
"E. Meyer" <e.meyer0SPAM@ieee.org> wrote in message
news:BCA40BEF.66A0F%e.meyer0SPAM@ieee.org...
>
> Did this problem by any chance start right after the timing belt
> replacement? Timing could be off by one belt tooth & that would be enough
> to cause overheating.
>
> On 4/14/04 9:37 PM, in article 107rt6i8j2q9o29@news.supernews.com, "G-Man"
> <g_foreman@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > Yes, replaced the thermostat. Oil was dirty on the stick, but nothing
> > unusual. Water Pump replaced along with Timing Belt last November.
Only 3k
> > on it.
> >
> > G-Man
> >
> >
> > "Condor" <condorski@mindspring.com> wrote in message
> > news:5dlfc.7122$l75.2509@newsread2.news.atl.earthl ink.net...
> >> Can you tell if anti freeze is in the oil?
> >>
> >> It could be the water pump. a water pump can
> >> break without totally failing, seizing, or leaking.
> >> If the impellers are worn badly, the water does not
> >> go through good. i have had this happen on
> >> a mustang. when i took the water pump off my
> >> crx, it was still going, but man, it was worn inside
> >> almost to nothing.
> >> If it is your head, there should be white yuck in
> >> your oil. Obviously you already replaced the
> >> thermostat (?)
> >>
> >> "G-Man" <somebody@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> >> news:107lb5a2u64gg39@news.supernews.com...
> >>> Still overheating. They replaced radiator saying it was clogged.
Still
> >> no
> >>> joy.
> >>>
> >>> Now saying head gasket.
> >>>
> >>> Any guesses on what I'm looking at for a head gasket replacement?
> >>>
> >>> G-Man
> >>>
> >>>
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
>
#17
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: 94 civic overheating saga...continues
G-Man wrote:
> That was replaced last November. Been good 'till now.
>
> G-Man
>
> "E. Meyer" <e.meyer0SPAM@ieee.org> wrote in message
> news:BCA40BEF.66A0F%e.meyer0SPAM@ieee.org...
>
>>Did this problem by any chance start right after the timing belt
>>replacement? Timing could be off by one belt tooth & that would be enough
>>to cause overheating.
>>
>>On 4/14/04 9:37 PM, in article 107rt6i8j2q9o29@news.supernews.com, "G-Man"
>><g_foreman@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>>Yes, replaced the thermostat. Oil was dirty on the stick, but nothing
>>>unusual. Water Pump replaced along with Timing Belt last November.
>
> Only 3k
>
>>>on it.
>>>
>>>G-Man
>>>
>>>
>>>"Condor" <condorski@mindspring.com> wrote in message
>>>news:5dlfc.7122$l75.2509@newsread2.news.atl.ear thlink.net...
>>>
>>>>Can you tell if anti freeze is in the oil?
>>>>
>>>>It could be the water pump. a water pump can
>>>>break without totally failing, seizing, or leaking.
>>>>If the impellers are worn badly, the water does not
>>>>go through good. i have had this happen on
>>>>a mustang. when i took the water pump off my
>>>>crx, it was still going, but man, it was worn inside
>>>>almost to nothing.
>>>>If it is your head, there should be white yuck in
>>>>your oil. Obviously you already replaced the
>>>>thermostat (?)
>>>>
>>>>"G-Man" <somebody@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>>>>news:107lb5a2u64gg39@news.supernews.com...
>>>>
>>>>>Still overheating. They replaced radiator saying it was clogged.
>
> Still
>
>>>>no
>>>>
>>>>>joy.
>>>>>
>>>>>Now saying head gasket.
>>>>>
>>>>>Any guesses on what I'm looking at for a head gasket replacement?
>>>>>
>>>>>G-Man
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>
>
Have you checked for collapsed hose when running?
Have a radiatior service center look at it, and have a pressure test
done on the radiator system. If it doesnt hold pressure you have the
answer usually. Head gasket MUST be replaced using an original HONDA
gasket or it can happen again, sooner than needed. Replace the full kit
as supplied. It allows a better job. I know i did and the bits i
replaced were all in need of replacement and supplied by the kit.
> That was replaced last November. Been good 'till now.
>
> G-Man
>
> "E. Meyer" <e.meyer0SPAM@ieee.org> wrote in message
> news:BCA40BEF.66A0F%e.meyer0SPAM@ieee.org...
>
>>Did this problem by any chance start right after the timing belt
>>replacement? Timing could be off by one belt tooth & that would be enough
>>to cause overheating.
>>
>>On 4/14/04 9:37 PM, in article 107rt6i8j2q9o29@news.supernews.com, "G-Man"
>><g_foreman@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>>Yes, replaced the thermostat. Oil was dirty on the stick, but nothing
>>>unusual. Water Pump replaced along with Timing Belt last November.
>
> Only 3k
>
>>>on it.
>>>
>>>G-Man
>>>
>>>
>>>"Condor" <condorski@mindspring.com> wrote in message
>>>news:5dlfc.7122$l75.2509@newsread2.news.atl.ear thlink.net...
>>>
>>>>Can you tell if anti freeze is in the oil?
>>>>
>>>>It could be the water pump. a water pump can
>>>>break without totally failing, seizing, or leaking.
>>>>If the impellers are worn badly, the water does not
>>>>go through good. i have had this happen on
>>>>a mustang. when i took the water pump off my
>>>>crx, it was still going, but man, it was worn inside
>>>>almost to nothing.
>>>>If it is your head, there should be white yuck in
>>>>your oil. Obviously you already replaced the
>>>>thermostat (?)
>>>>
>>>>"G-Man" <somebody@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>>>>news:107lb5a2u64gg39@news.supernews.com...
>>>>
>>>>>Still overheating. They replaced radiator saying it was clogged.
>
> Still
>
>>>>no
>>>>
>>>>>joy.
>>>>>
>>>>>Now saying head gasket.
>>>>>
>>>>>Any guesses on what I'm looking at for a head gasket replacement?
>>>>>
>>>>>G-Man
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>
>
Have you checked for collapsed hose when running?
Have a radiatior service center look at it, and have a pressure test
done on the radiator system. If it doesnt hold pressure you have the
answer usually. Head gasket MUST be replaced using an original HONDA
gasket or it can happen again, sooner than needed. Replace the full kit
as supplied. It allows a better job. I know i did and the bits i
replaced were all in need of replacement and supplied by the kit.
#18
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: 94 civic overheating saga...continues
"G-Man" <somebody@yahoo.com> wrote in message news:<107lb5a2u64gg39@news.supernews.com>...
> Still overheating. They replaced radiator saying it was clogged. Still no
> joy.
>
> Now saying head gasket.
>
> Any guesses on what I'm looking at for a head gasket replacement?
>
> G-Man
Could well be a head gasket. You won't be the only one on this model.
It's a vicious circle: overheating causes head warping causes head
gasket losing seal causes overheating.
Gasket replacement itself isn't horribly expensive, if the car is
worth keeping, maybe $350?
But it's the possible incidentals; if head is warped from overheating
or just naturally, new gasket will go out like old did within a while.
Besides, after this age, the car might want a new head, so you'd need
to look at the valves from inside once you get the head off, or just
bite the bullet and decide in advance. Head from Honda is ridiculously
expensive, rebuilt heads from places much cheaper, maybe $250 and up,
you can get them all built up with valves and stuff. Do a search.
Decide whether you need to replace the cams or not. Is it VTEC? More
cams. It can be iffy using an older cam with new hardware; the cam
lobe and the pieces that rub on them wear to fit each other like an
old married couple, and replacing one of them and not the other can
cause rapid wearing out. Or if the head is generally OK, you might
want to just replace the valve seals while the head is out, that's not
too bad and they wear out, and it's easier than doing it on an
assembled engine in a couple of years.
Another hassle: warranty. As mentioned above, they can botch a head
replacement or head gasket replacement, and it won't blow for a while.
On the other hand, the mechanic doesn't want to be on the hook if you
overheat it next summer and warp the head again. On top of which, if
it's a rebuilt head, if the rebuilder isn't very careful in cleaning
out metal chips etc. from cooling and especially oil passages,
obviously there will be trouble. A lot of engines that really
physically blow up; throw a con rod, etc., have had recent overhauls,
rebuilt heads, etc. (including one I bought once) so that's a sign to
be wary. On the other hand, the last head I bought built up, street
performance wise, was from PAECO automotive in GA, and it was just
beautiful, and so clean you could eat off it, etc. They've been doing
compact/import performance since forever, not just the current craze.
Hot rod Pintos, etc. Allocate maybe $500 for an average rebuilt head
swap.
Of course, you can shop around for a new engine, if you live somewhere
where people are swapping in the DOHC b16A engines to replace the
stock SOHC ones, you can often get the old takeout SOHC for as low as
$50 if you haul it away. Labor to swap isn't a hell of a lot more than
the head work, say $500, and since you're not messing with the head
replacement, either the engine will work when it's in or it won't,
length of warranty coverage isn't such an issue. Of course, you are
reasonably likely to get something that has problems too so you
definitely want some coverage. Or you can join the fun and get a DOHC
yourself and swap it in.
> Still overheating. They replaced radiator saying it was clogged. Still no
> joy.
>
> Now saying head gasket.
>
> Any guesses on what I'm looking at for a head gasket replacement?
>
> G-Man
Could well be a head gasket. You won't be the only one on this model.
It's a vicious circle: overheating causes head warping causes head
gasket losing seal causes overheating.
Gasket replacement itself isn't horribly expensive, if the car is
worth keeping, maybe $350?
But it's the possible incidentals; if head is warped from overheating
or just naturally, new gasket will go out like old did within a while.
Besides, after this age, the car might want a new head, so you'd need
to look at the valves from inside once you get the head off, or just
bite the bullet and decide in advance. Head from Honda is ridiculously
expensive, rebuilt heads from places much cheaper, maybe $250 and up,
you can get them all built up with valves and stuff. Do a search.
Decide whether you need to replace the cams or not. Is it VTEC? More
cams. It can be iffy using an older cam with new hardware; the cam
lobe and the pieces that rub on them wear to fit each other like an
old married couple, and replacing one of them and not the other can
cause rapid wearing out. Or if the head is generally OK, you might
want to just replace the valve seals while the head is out, that's not
too bad and they wear out, and it's easier than doing it on an
assembled engine in a couple of years.
Another hassle: warranty. As mentioned above, they can botch a head
replacement or head gasket replacement, and it won't blow for a while.
On the other hand, the mechanic doesn't want to be on the hook if you
overheat it next summer and warp the head again. On top of which, if
it's a rebuilt head, if the rebuilder isn't very careful in cleaning
out metal chips etc. from cooling and especially oil passages,
obviously there will be trouble. A lot of engines that really
physically blow up; throw a con rod, etc., have had recent overhauls,
rebuilt heads, etc. (including one I bought once) so that's a sign to
be wary. On the other hand, the last head I bought built up, street
performance wise, was from PAECO automotive in GA, and it was just
beautiful, and so clean you could eat off it, etc. They've been doing
compact/import performance since forever, not just the current craze.
Hot rod Pintos, etc. Allocate maybe $500 for an average rebuilt head
swap.
Of course, you can shop around for a new engine, if you live somewhere
where people are swapping in the DOHC b16A engines to replace the
stock SOHC ones, you can often get the old takeout SOHC for as low as
$50 if you haul it away. Labor to swap isn't a hell of a lot more than
the head work, say $500, and since you're not messing with the head
replacement, either the engine will work when it's in or it won't,
length of warranty coverage isn't such an issue. Of course, you are
reasonably likely to get something that has problems too so you
definitely want some coverage. Or you can join the fun and get a DOHC
yourself and swap it in.
#19
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: 94 civic overheating saga...continues
"Cosmin N." <no@email.com> wrote in message news:<31Uec.254$le3.186@news04.bloor.is.net.cable. rogers.com>...
> John McConnell wrote:
>
> > Check EVERYTHING else before you do the head gasket. This was
> > happening to my car and I spent $900 for head gasket/thermostat and
> > that didn't fix the problem. Obviously, it's something cheaper.
> >
> > John
>
> Sorry to say this, but the head gasket should be the very last thing to
> replace when trying to fix a car when there isn't a clear evidence
> that's where the fault is. I used to have an old 86 Camry that would
> overheat in the same circumstances, and when I took it to Canadian Tire
> the first thing they wanted to do was replace the head gasket for
> CAD$1500 (CAD$1=US75c). It turned out to be a clogged, leaky radiator
> which only cost me CAD$200 for a new one, including installation.
>
> In the worst case scenario when avoiding changing the head gasket you'll
> replace other minor components that probably needed replacement anyway.
>
> Cosmin
That's standard mechanical practice, for pretty much any repair start
at the most expensive end. Mechanics don't want to start out by
replacing the thermostat for $50 and it doesn't work, so they end up
swapping the head for free as warranty on their repair, and it costs
them $900; they'd rather swap the head and have you pay $900, and if
that doesn't work they'll replace the thermostat and eat the $50.
> John McConnell wrote:
>
> > Check EVERYTHING else before you do the head gasket. This was
> > happening to my car and I spent $900 for head gasket/thermostat and
> > that didn't fix the problem. Obviously, it's something cheaper.
> >
> > John
>
> Sorry to say this, but the head gasket should be the very last thing to
> replace when trying to fix a car when there isn't a clear evidence
> that's where the fault is. I used to have an old 86 Camry that would
> overheat in the same circumstances, and when I took it to Canadian Tire
> the first thing they wanted to do was replace the head gasket for
> CAD$1500 (CAD$1=US75c). It turned out to be a clogged, leaky radiator
> which only cost me CAD$200 for a new one, including installation.
>
> In the worst case scenario when avoiding changing the head gasket you'll
> replace other minor components that probably needed replacement anyway.
>
> Cosmin
That's standard mechanical practice, for pretty much any repair start
at the most expensive end. Mechanics don't want to start out by
replacing the thermostat for $50 and it doesn't work, so they end up
swapping the head for free as warranty on their repair, and it costs
them $900; they'd rather swap the head and have you pay $900, and if
that doesn't work they'll replace the thermostat and eat the $50.
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