"jim beam" <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote in message
news:AZWdnY-IsL1BVGPZnZ2dnUVZ_vydnZ2d@speakeasy.net...
> you'd both be right if this vehicle had a chain driven cam, but this is a
> belt driven cam, so the only way you'll get erratic timing is if the belt
> is loose. go to a junk yard and check this for yourself - there's only
> maybe 30% of belts set right. it's something i'd have a hard time
> believing myself unless i'd seen it. so, if y'all have this issue, check
> your belt tension.

I've had erratic timing three times, all with gear driven cams. In our 64
Dodge the gear on the distributor lost some teeth (apparently not that
uncommon), in the '70 Volvo the plate the advance weights rode on wore so
the advance plate jumped rather than slid, and in the same car the
distributor shaft actually cracked. They are admittedly not mainstream
problems, but they are nearly impossible to pin down without a timing light.

Mike

 

Grumpy AuContraire wrote:
>
> Michael Pardee wrote:
>> "Grumpy AuContraire" <Grumpster@GrumpyvilleNOT.com> wrote in message
>> news:44FE5B25.DCB76BBD@GrumpyvilleNOT.com...
>>>
>>> Zephyr wrote:
>>>> I had to replace the distributer on my 93 civic 5 years ago when the
>>>> bearing went bad. I took the old one out and popped in a new one,
>>>> without making carefull note of the allignment. just as you describe
>>>> with yours, the car was a pig when I started it up. it also sounded
>>>> rough. I loosened the bolts on the distibuter, started the car up and
>>>> slowly turned the hole assmebly just slightly listening to what sounded
>>>> best. when It sounded good, I tightened the bolts back up. I must
>>>> have got it right cause my sister has the car now and it has well over
>>>> 240,000 miles now.
>>>>
>>>> my 2 cents
>>>>
>>>> Dave
>>>
>>>
>>> The only way to go on high mileage vehicles. Often, a timing light is
>>> useless in such situations. Been doing it by "feel/sound" for years...
>>>
>>> JT
>> Mostly, that works well. An exception is when the distributor is failing and
>> the timing is erratic - there is no correct setting then, and a timing light
>> will show the timing is jumping around. The timing light is a great
>> diagnostic help for that, as it points a big red arrow at the distributor.
>> Of course, if there is anything seriously wrong with the fuel or valves the
>> timing can't be set by ear (and sometimes not even set quite right with a
>> light) because the operation is never right.
>>
>> Mike
>
>
> A failing distributor should be pretty easy to catch. Of course, I
> working with relatively primitive cars (the newest being the '83 Civic).
> Valve problems hopefully would be on the noisy side.
>
> I'm used to the simpler old style vacuum advance distributors where the
> timing was set with the vacuum disconnected. One could then use a
> timing light to check the rate of advance when applying the gas pedal.
> Easy task on an old V8 where everything is out in the open.
>
> On my '83 Civic, the long sleep that it endured left the whole
> vacuum-electro-mechanical control system in some disarray. For example,
> when I first got the car running in May, the spark would advance by
> turning the distributor counter clockwise which is the opposite of what
> the manual calls for. Later, it would not respond at all and now it
> seems to work (somewhat) as it should.
>
> The vacuum for the advance is tapped of of the carb insulator which is
> of course below the butterfly. Since manifold vacuum decreases when the
> butterfly(s) are opened, how would this advance timing. The vacuum line
> is a "T" with the other line going to "Control Box 1."
>
> <shudder>
>
> JT
>
> (Amazed by those crafty Japanese engineers...)

the 93 civic has neither vacuum advance not centrifugal weights - it's
all electronically controlled with timing maps stored in the ecu.

 

Grumpy AuContraire wrote:
>
> Michael Pardee wrote:
>> "Grumpy AuContraire" <Grumpster@GrumpyvilleNOT.com> wrote in message
>> news:44FE5B25.DCB76BBD@GrumpyvilleNOT.com...
>>>
>>> Zephyr wrote:
>>>> I had to replace the distributer on my 93 civic 5 years ago when the
>>>> bearing went bad. I took the old one out and popped in a new one,
>>>> without making carefull note of the allignment. just as you describe
>>>> with yours, the car was a pig when I started it up. it also sounded
>>>> rough. I loosened the bolts on the distibuter, started the car up and
>>>> slowly turned the hole assmebly just slightly listening to what sounded
>>>> best. when It sounded good, I tightened the bolts back up. I must
>>>> have got it right cause my sister has the car now and it has well over
>>>> 240,000 miles now.
>>>>
>>>> my 2 cents
>>>>
>>>> Dave
>>>
>>>
>>> The only way to go on high mileage vehicles. Often, a timing light is
>>> useless in such situations. Been doing it by "feel/sound" for years...
>>>
>>> JT
>> Mostly, that works well. An exception is when the distributor is failing and
>> the timing is erratic - there is no correct setting then, and a timing light
>> will show the timing is jumping around. The timing light is a great
>> diagnostic help for that, as it points a big red arrow at the distributor.
>> Of course, if there is anything seriously wrong with the fuel or valves the
>> timing can't be set by ear (and sometimes not even set quite right with a
>> light) because the operation is never right.
>>
>> Mike
>
>
> A failing distributor should be pretty easy to catch. Of course, I
> working with relatively primitive cars (the newest being the '83 Civic).
> Valve problems hopefully would be on the noisy side.
>
> I'm used to the simpler old style vacuum advance distributors where the
> timing was set with the vacuum disconnected. One could then use a
> timing light to check the rate of advance when applying the gas pedal.
> Easy task on an old V8 where everything is out in the open.
>
> On my '83 Civic, the long sleep that it endured left the whole
> vacuum-electro-mechanical control system in some disarray. For example,
> when I first got the car running in May, the spark would advance by
> turning the distributor counter clockwise which is the opposite of what
> the manual calls for. Later, it would not respond at all and now it
> seems to work (somewhat) as it should.
>
> The vacuum for the advance is tapped of of the carb insulator which is
> of course below the butterfly. Since manifold vacuum decreases when the
> butterfly(s) are opened, how would this advance timing. The vacuum line
> is a "T" with the other line going to "Control Box 1."
>
> <shudder>
>
> JT
>
> (Amazed by those crafty Japanese engineers...)

the 93 civic has neither vacuum advance not centrifugal weights - it's
all electronically controlled with timing maps stored in the ecu.

 

Grumpy AuContraire wrote:
>
> Michael Pardee wrote:
>> "Grumpy AuContraire" <Grumpster@GrumpyvilleNOT.com> wrote in message
>> news:44FE5B25.DCB76BBD@GrumpyvilleNOT.com...
>>>
>>> Zephyr wrote:
>>>> I had to replace the distributer on my 93 civic 5 years ago when the
>>>> bearing went bad. I took the old one out and popped in a new one,
>>>> without making carefull note of the allignment. just as you describe
>>>> with yours, the car was a pig when I started it up. it also sounded
>>>> rough. I loosened the bolts on the distibuter, started the car up and
>>>> slowly turned the hole assmebly just slightly listening to what sounded
>>>> best. when It sounded good, I tightened the bolts back up. I must
>>>> have got it right cause my sister has the car now and it has well over
>>>> 240,000 miles now.
>>>>
>>>> my 2 cents
>>>>
>>>> Dave
>>>
>>>
>>> The only way to go on high mileage vehicles. Often, a timing light is
>>> useless in such situations. Been doing it by "feel/sound" for years...
>>>
>>> JT
>> Mostly, that works well. An exception is when the distributor is failing and
>> the timing is erratic - there is no correct setting then, and a timing light
>> will show the timing is jumping around. The timing light is a great
>> diagnostic help for that, as it points a big red arrow at the distributor.
>> Of course, if there is anything seriously wrong with the fuel or valves the
>> timing can't be set by ear (and sometimes not even set quite right with a
>> light) because the operation is never right.
>>
>> Mike
>
>
> A failing distributor should be pretty easy to catch. Of course, I
> working with relatively primitive cars (the newest being the '83 Civic).
> Valve problems hopefully would be on the noisy side.
>
> I'm used to the simpler old style vacuum advance distributors where the
> timing was set with the vacuum disconnected. One could then use a
> timing light to check the rate of advance when applying the gas pedal.
> Easy task on an old V8 where everything is out in the open.
>
> On my '83 Civic, the long sleep that it endured left the whole
> vacuum-electro-mechanical control system in some disarray. For example,
> when I first got the car running in May, the spark would advance by
> turning the distributor counter clockwise which is the opposite of what
> the manual calls for. Later, it would not respond at all and now it
> seems to work (somewhat) as it should.
>
> The vacuum for the advance is tapped of of the carb insulator which is
> of course below the butterfly. Since manifold vacuum decreases when the
> butterfly(s) are opened, how would this advance timing. The vacuum line
> is a "T" with the other line going to "Control Box 1."
>
> <shudder>
>
> JT
>
> (Amazed by those crafty Japanese engineers...)

the 93 civic has neither vacuum advance not centrifugal weights - it's
all electronically controlled with timing maps stored in the ecu.

 

Grumpy AuContraire wrote:
>
> jim beam wrote:
>> Michael Pardee wrote:
>>> "Grumpy AuContraire" <Grumpster@GrumpyvilleNOT.com> wrote in message
>>> news:44FE5B25.DCB76BBD@GrumpyvilleNOT.com...
>>>> Zephyr wrote:
>>>>> I had to replace the distributer on my 93 civic 5 years ago when the
>>>>> bearing went bad. I took the old one out and popped in a new one,
>>>>> without making carefull note of the allignment. just as you describe
>>>>> with yours, the car was a pig when I started it up. it also sounded
>>>>> rough. I loosened the bolts on the distibuter, started the car up and
>>>>> slowly turned the hole assmebly just slightly listening to what sounded
>>>>> best. when It sounded good, I tightened the bolts back up. I must
>>>>> have got it right cause my sister has the car now and it has well over
>>>>> 240,000 miles now.
>>>>>
>>>>> my 2 cents
>>>>>
>>>>> Dave
>>>>
>>>> The only way to go on high mileage vehicles. Often, a timing light is
>>>> useless in such situations. Been doing it by "feel/sound" for years...
>>>>
>>>> JT
>>> Mostly, that works well. An exception is when the distributor is failing and
>>> the timing is erratic - there is no correct setting then, and a timing light
>>> will show the timing is jumping around. The timing light is a great
>>> diagnostic help for that, as it points a big red arrow at the distributor.
>>> Of course, if there is anything seriously wrong with the fuel or valves the
>>> timing can't be set by ear (and sometimes not even set quite right with a
>>> light) because the operation is never right.
>>>
>>> Mike
>>>
>>>
>> you'd both be right if this vehicle had a chain driven cam, but this is
>> a belt driven cam, so the only way you'll get erratic timing is if the
>> belt is loose. go to a junk yard and check this for yourself - there's
>> only maybe 30% of belts set right. it's something i'd have a hard time
>> believing myself unless i'd seen it. so, if y'all have this issue,
>> check your belt tension.
>
>
> I'm not an expert in later model distributors but if the centrifugal
> weights are on their way out, that should cause erratic timing. Late
> Hondas may not even have such things...

indeed, they don't.

> Geeeez, I'm not an expert on
> any Honda I guess.
>
> Though off topic sort of, that was a common problem with my Studebakers
> with Prestojunk distributors with the only good cure being a replacement
> with the solid earlier GM Delco distributor. I had one NOS Prestolite
> go belly up after a measly 16K miles and that's the reason they no
> longer exist in my inventory (the distributors that is).
>
> JT

 

Grumpy AuContraire wrote:
>
> jim beam wrote:
>> Michael Pardee wrote:
>>> "Grumpy AuContraire" <Grumpster@GrumpyvilleNOT.com> wrote in message
>>> news:44FE5B25.DCB76BBD@GrumpyvilleNOT.com...
>>>> Zephyr wrote:
>>>>> I had to replace the distributer on my 93 civic 5 years ago when the
>>>>> bearing went bad. I took the old one out and popped in a new one,
>>>>> without making carefull note of the allignment. just as you describe
>>>>> with yours, the car was a pig when I started it up. it also sounded
>>>>> rough. I loosened the bolts on the distibuter, started the car up and
>>>>> slowly turned the hole assmebly just slightly listening to what sounded
>>>>> best. when It sounded good, I tightened the bolts back up. I must
>>>>> have got it right cause my sister has the car now and it has well over
>>>>> 240,000 miles now.
>>>>>
>>>>> my 2 cents
>>>>>
>>>>> Dave
>>>>
>>>> The only way to go on high mileage vehicles. Often, a timing light is
>>>> useless in such situations. Been doing it by "feel/sound" for years...
>>>>
>>>> JT
>>> Mostly, that works well. An exception is when the distributor is failing and
>>> the timing is erratic - there is no correct setting then, and a timing light
>>> will show the timing is jumping around. The timing light is a great
>>> diagnostic help for that, as it points a big red arrow at the distributor.
>>> Of course, if there is anything seriously wrong with the fuel or valves the
>>> timing can't be set by ear (and sometimes not even set quite right with a
>>> light) because the operation is never right.
>>>
>>> Mike
>>>
>>>
>> you'd both be right if this vehicle had a chain driven cam, but this is
>> a belt driven cam, so the only way you'll get erratic timing is if the
>> belt is loose. go to a junk yard and check this for yourself - there's
>> only maybe 30% of belts set right. it's something i'd have a hard time
>> believing myself unless i'd seen it. so, if y'all have this issue,
>> check your belt tension.
>
>
> I'm not an expert in later model distributors but if the centrifugal
> weights are on their way out, that should cause erratic timing. Late
> Hondas may not even have such things...

indeed, they don't.

> Geeeez, I'm not an expert on
> any Honda I guess.
>
> Though off topic sort of, that was a common problem with my Studebakers
> with Prestojunk distributors with the only good cure being a replacement
> with the solid earlier GM Delco distributor. I had one NOS Prestolite
> go belly up after a measly 16K miles and that's the reason they no
> longer exist in my inventory (the distributors that is).
>
> JT

 

Grumpy AuContraire wrote:
>
> jim beam wrote:
>> Michael Pardee wrote:
>>> "Grumpy AuContraire" <Grumpster@GrumpyvilleNOT.com> wrote in message
>>> news:44FE5B25.DCB76BBD@GrumpyvilleNOT.com...
>>>> Zephyr wrote:
>>>>> I had to replace the distributer on my 93 civic 5 years ago when the
>>>>> bearing went bad. I took the old one out and popped in a new one,
>>>>> without making carefull note of the allignment. just as you describe
>>>>> with yours, the car was a pig when I started it up. it also sounded
>>>>> rough. I loosened the bolts on the distibuter, started the car up and
>>>>> slowly turned the hole assmebly just slightly listening to what sounded
>>>>> best. when It sounded good, I tightened the bolts back up. I must
>>>>> have got it right cause my sister has the car now and it has well over
>>>>> 240,000 miles now.
>>>>>
>>>>> my 2 cents
>>>>>
>>>>> Dave
>>>>
>>>> The only way to go on high mileage vehicles. Often, a timing light is
>>>> useless in such situations. Been doing it by "feel/sound" for years...
>>>>
>>>> JT
>>> Mostly, that works well. An exception is when the distributor is failing and
>>> the timing is erratic - there is no correct setting then, and a timing light
>>> will show the timing is jumping around. The timing light is a great
>>> diagnostic help for that, as it points a big red arrow at the distributor.
>>> Of course, if there is anything seriously wrong with the fuel or valves the
>>> timing can't be set by ear (and sometimes not even set quite right with a
>>> light) because the operation is never right.
>>>
>>> Mike
>>>
>>>
>> you'd both be right if this vehicle had a chain driven cam, but this is
>> a belt driven cam, so the only way you'll get erratic timing is if the
>> belt is loose. go to a junk yard and check this for yourself - there's
>> only maybe 30% of belts set right. it's something i'd have a hard time
>> believing myself unless i'd seen it. so, if y'all have this issue,
>> check your belt tension.
>
>
> I'm not an expert in later model distributors but if the centrifugal
> weights are on their way out, that should cause erratic timing. Late
> Hondas may not even have such things...

indeed, they don't.

> Geeeez, I'm not an expert on
> any Honda I guess.
>
> Though off topic sort of, that was a common problem with my Studebakers
> with Prestojunk distributors with the only good cure being a replacement
> with the solid earlier GM Delco distributor. I had one NOS Prestolite
> go belly up after a measly 16K miles and that's the reason they no
> longer exist in my inventory (the distributors that is).
>
> JT

 

jim beam wrote:
>
> Grumpy AuContraire wrote:
> >
> > Michael Pardee wrote:
> >> "Grumpy AuContraire" <Grumpster@GrumpyvilleNOT.com> wrote in message
> >> news:44FE5B25.DCB76BBD@GrumpyvilleNOT.com...
> >>>
> >>> Zephyr wrote:
> >>>> I had to replace the distributer on my 93 civic 5 years ago when the
> >>>> bearing went bad. I took the old one out and popped in a new one,
> >>>> without making carefull note of the allignment. just as you describe
> >>>> with yours, the car was a pig when I started it up. it also sounded
> >>>> rough. I loosened the bolts on the distibuter, started the car up and
> >>>> slowly turned the hole assmebly just slightly listening to what sounded
> >>>> best. when It sounded good, I tightened the bolts back up. I must
> >>>> have got it right cause my sister has the car now and it has well over
> >>>> 240,000 miles now.
> >>>>
> >>>> my 2 cents
> >>>>
> >>>> Dave
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> The only way to go on high mileage vehicles. Often, a timing light is
> >>> useless in such situations. Been doing it by "feel/sound" for years...
> >>>
> >>> JT
> >> Mostly, that works well. An exception is when the distributor is failing and
> >> the timing is erratic - there is no correct setting then, and a timing light
> >> will show the timing is jumping around. The timing light is a great
> >> diagnostic help for that, as it points a big red arrow at the distributor.
> >> Of course, if there is anything seriously wrong with the fuel or valves the
> >> timing can't be set by ear (and sometimes not even set quite right with a
> >> light) because the operation is never right.
> >>
> >> Mike
> >
> >
> > A failing distributor should be pretty easy to catch. Of course, I
> > working with relatively primitive cars (the newest being the '83 Civic).
> > Valve problems hopefully would be on the noisy side.
> >
> > I'm used to the simpler old style vacuum advance distributors where the
> > timing was set with the vacuum disconnected. One could then use a
> > timing light to check the rate of advance when applying the gas pedal.
> > Easy task on an old V8 where everything is out in the open.
> >
> > On my '83 Civic, the long sleep that it endured left the whole
> > vacuum-electro-mechanical control system in some disarray. For example,
> > when I first got the car running in May, the spark would advance by
> > turning the distributor counter clockwise which is the opposite of what
> > the manual calls for. Later, it would not respond at all and now it
> > seems to work (somewhat) as it should.
> >
> > The vacuum for the advance is tapped of of the carb insulator which is
> > of course below the butterfly. Since manifold vacuum decreases when the
> > butterfly(s) are opened, how would this advance timing. The vacuum line
> > is a "T" with the other line going to "Control Box 1."
> >
> > <shudder>
> >
> > JT
> >
> > (Amazed by those crafty Japanese engineers...)
>
> the 93 civic has neither vacuum advance not centrifugal weights - it's
> all electronically controlled with timing maps stored in the ecu.


Which in turn limits the ability to resolve issues by the consumer. I
suppose (or hope) that failures are rare with Hondas. Detroit junk
OTOH, could cause a lot of sleepless nights...

JT

 

jim beam wrote:
>
> Grumpy AuContraire wrote:
> >
> > Michael Pardee wrote:
> >> "Grumpy AuContraire" <Grumpster@GrumpyvilleNOT.com> wrote in message
> >> news:44FE5B25.DCB76BBD@GrumpyvilleNOT.com...
> >>>
> >>> Zephyr wrote:
> >>>> I had to replace the distributer on my 93 civic 5 years ago when the
> >>>> bearing went bad. I took the old one out and popped in a new one,
> >>>> without making carefull note of the allignment. just as you describe
> >>>> with yours, the car was a pig when I started it up. it also sounded
> >>>> rough. I loosened the bolts on the distibuter, started the car up and
> >>>> slowly turned the hole assmebly just slightly listening to what sounded
> >>>> best. when It sounded good, I tightened the bolts back up. I must
> >>>> have got it right cause my sister has the car now and it has well over
> >>>> 240,000 miles now.
> >>>>
> >>>> my 2 cents
> >>>>
> >>>> Dave
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> The only way to go on high mileage vehicles. Often, a timing light is
> >>> useless in such situations. Been doing it by "feel/sound" for years...
> >>>
> >>> JT
> >> Mostly, that works well. An exception is when the distributor is failing and
> >> the timing is erratic - there is no correct setting then, and a timing light
> >> will show the timing is jumping around. The timing light is a great
> >> diagnostic help for that, as it points a big red arrow at the distributor.
> >> Of course, if there is anything seriously wrong with the fuel or valves the
> >> timing can't be set by ear (and sometimes not even set quite right with a
> >> light) because the operation is never right.
> >>
> >> Mike
> >
> >
> > A failing distributor should be pretty easy to catch. Of course, I
> > working with relatively primitive cars (the newest being the '83 Civic).
> > Valve problems hopefully would be on the noisy side.
> >
> > I'm used to the simpler old style vacuum advance distributors where the
> > timing was set with the vacuum disconnected. One could then use a
> > timing light to check the rate of advance when applying the gas pedal.
> > Easy task on an old V8 where everything is out in the open.
> >
> > On my '83 Civic, the long sleep that it endured left the whole
> > vacuum-electro-mechanical control system in some disarray. For example,
> > when I first got the car running in May, the spark would advance by
> > turning the distributor counter clockwise which is the opposite of what
> > the manual calls for. Later, it would not respond at all and now it
> > seems to work (somewhat) as it should.
> >
> > The vacuum for the advance is tapped of of the carb insulator which is
> > of course below the butterfly. Since manifold vacuum decreases when the
> > butterfly(s) are opened, how would this advance timing. The vacuum line
> > is a "T" with the other line going to "Control Box 1."
> >
> > <shudder>
> >
> > JT
> >
> > (Amazed by those crafty Japanese engineers...)
>
> the 93 civic has neither vacuum advance not centrifugal weights - it's
> all electronically controlled with timing maps stored in the ecu.


Which in turn limits the ability to resolve issues by the consumer. I
suppose (or hope) that failures are rare with Hondas. Detroit junk
OTOH, could cause a lot of sleepless nights...

JT

 

jim beam wrote:
>
> Grumpy AuContraire wrote:
> >
> > Michael Pardee wrote:
> >> "Grumpy AuContraire" <Grumpster@GrumpyvilleNOT.com> wrote in message
> >> news:44FE5B25.DCB76BBD@GrumpyvilleNOT.com...
> >>>
> >>> Zephyr wrote:
> >>>> I had to replace the distributer on my 93 civic 5 years ago when the
> >>>> bearing went bad. I took the old one out and popped in a new one,
> >>>> without making carefull note of the allignment. just as you describe
> >>>> with yours, the car was a pig when I started it up. it also sounded
> >>>> rough. I loosened the bolts on the distibuter, started the car up and
> >>>> slowly turned the hole assmebly just slightly listening to what sounded
> >>>> best. when It sounded good, I tightened the bolts back up. I must
> >>>> have got it right cause my sister has the car now and it has well over
> >>>> 240,000 miles now.
> >>>>
> >>>> my 2 cents
> >>>>
> >>>> Dave
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> The only way to go on high mileage vehicles. Often, a timing light is
> >>> useless in such situations. Been doing it by "feel/sound" for years...
> >>>
> >>> JT
> >> Mostly, that works well. An exception is when the distributor is failing and
> >> the timing is erratic - there is no correct setting then, and a timing light
> >> will show the timing is jumping around. The timing light is a great
> >> diagnostic help for that, as it points a big red arrow at the distributor.
> >> Of course, if there is anything seriously wrong with the fuel or valves the
> >> timing can't be set by ear (and sometimes not even set quite right with a
> >> light) because the operation is never right.
> >>
> >> Mike
> >
> >
> > A failing distributor should be pretty easy to catch. Of course, I
> > working with relatively primitive cars (the newest being the '83 Civic).
> > Valve problems hopefully would be on the noisy side.
> >
> > I'm used to the simpler old style vacuum advance distributors where the
> > timing was set with the vacuum disconnected. One could then use a
> > timing light to check the rate of advance when applying the gas pedal.
> > Easy task on an old V8 where everything is out in the open.
> >
> > On my '83 Civic, the long sleep that it endured left the whole
> > vacuum-electro-mechanical control system in some disarray. For example,
> > when I first got the car running in May, the spark would advance by
> > turning the distributor counter clockwise which is the opposite of what
> > the manual calls for. Later, it would not respond at all and now it
> > seems to work (somewhat) as it should.
> >
> > The vacuum for the advance is tapped of of the carb insulator which is
> > of course below the butterfly. Since manifold vacuum decreases when the
> > butterfly(s) are opened, how would this advance timing. The vacuum line
> > is a "T" with the other line going to "Control Box 1."
> >
> > <shudder>
> >
> > JT
> >
> > (Amazed by those crafty Japanese engineers...)
>
> the 93 civic has neither vacuum advance not centrifugal weights - it's
> all electronically controlled with timing maps stored in the ecu.


Which in turn limits the ability to resolve issues by the consumer. I
suppose (or hope) that failures are rare with Hondas. Detroit junk
OTOH, could cause a lot of sleepless nights...

JT

 

Grumpy AuContraire <Grumpster@GrumpyvilleNOT.com> wrote in
news:44FF87BE.88CB2DB8@GrumpyvilleNOT.com:

>
>
> jim beam wrote:
>>
>> Grumpy AuContraire wrote:
>> >
>> > Michael Pardee wrote:
>> >> "Grumpy AuContraire" <Grumpster@GrumpyvilleNOT.com> wrote in
>> >> message news:44FE5B25.DCB76BBD@GrumpyvilleNOT.com...
>> >>>
>> >>> Zephyr wrote:
>> >>>> I had to replace the distributer on my 93 civic 5 years ago when
>> >>>> the bearing went bad. I took the old one out and popped in a
>> >>>> new one, without making carefull note of the allignment. just
>> >>>> as you describe with yours, the car was a pig when I started it
>> >>>> up. it also sounded rough. I loosened the bolts on the
>> >>>> distibuter, started the car up and slowly turned the hole
>> >>>> assmebly just slightly listening to what sounded best. when It
>> >>>> sounded good, I tightened the bolts back up. I must have got it
>> >>>> right cause my sister has the car now and it has well over
>> >>>> 240,000 miles now.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> my 2 cents
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Dave
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> The only way to go on high mileage vehicles. Often, a timing
>> >>> light is useless in such situations. Been doing it by
>> >>> "feel/sound" for years...
>> >>>
>> >>> JT
>> >> Mostly, that works well. An exception is when the distributor is
>> >> failing and the timing is erratic - there is no correct setting
>> >> then, and a timing light will show the timing is jumping around.
>> >> The timing light is a great diagnostic help for that, as it points
>> >> a big red arrow at the distributor. Of course, if there is
>> >> anything seriously wrong with the fuel or valves the timing can't
>> >> be set by ear (and sometimes not even set quite right with a
>> >> light) because the operation is never right.
>> >>
>> >> Mike
>> >
>> >
>> > A failing distributor should be pretty easy to catch. Of course, I
>> > working with relatively primitive cars (the newest being the '83
>> > Civic).
>> > Valve problems hopefully would be on the noisy side.
>> >
>> > I'm used to the simpler old style vacuum advance distributors where
>> > the timing was set with the vacuum disconnected. One could then
>> > use a timing light to check the rate of advance when applying the
>> > gas pedal. Easy task on an old V8 where everything is out in the
>> > open.
>> >
>> > On my '83 Civic, the long sleep that it endured left the whole
>> > vacuum-electro-mechanical control system in some disarray. For
>> > example,
>> > when I first got the car running in May, the spark would advance
>> > by
>> > turning the distributor counter clockwise which is the opposite of
>> > what the manual calls for. Later, it would not respond at all and
>> > now it seems to work (somewhat) as it should.
>> >
>> > The vacuum for the advance is tapped of of the carb insulator which
>> > is of course below the butterfly. Since manifold vacuum decreases
>> > when the butterfly(s) are opened, how would this advance timing.
>> > The vacuum line is a "T" with the other line going to "Control Box
>> > 1."
>> >
>> > <shudder>
>> >
>> > JT
>> >
>> > (Amazed by those crafty Japanese engineers...)
>>
>> the 93 civic has neither vacuum advance not centrifugal weights -
>> it's all electronically controlled with timing maps stored in the
>> ecu.
>
>
> Which in turn limits the ability to resolve issues by the consumer. I
> suppose (or hope) that failures are rare with Hondas. Detroit junk
> OTOH, could cause a lot of sleepless nights...
>
> JT
>

You can always get a Hondata programmable ECU,and a laptop will allow you
to reconfigure as you wish.

--
Jim Yanik
jyanik
at
kua.net

 

Grumpy AuContraire <Grumpster@GrumpyvilleNOT.com> wrote in
news:44FF87BE.88CB2DB8@GrumpyvilleNOT.com:

>
>
> jim beam wrote:
>>
>> Grumpy AuContraire wrote:
>> >
>> > Michael Pardee wrote:
>> >> "Grumpy AuContraire" <Grumpster@GrumpyvilleNOT.com> wrote in
>> >> message news:44FE5B25.DCB76BBD@GrumpyvilleNOT.com...
>> >>>
>> >>> Zephyr wrote:
>> >>>> I had to replace the distributer on my 93 civic 5 years ago when
>> >>>> the bearing went bad. I took the old one out and popped in a
>> >>>> new one, without making carefull note of the allignment. just
>> >>>> as you describe with yours, the car was a pig when I started it
>> >>>> up. it also sounded rough. I loosened the bolts on the
>> >>>> distibuter, started the car up and slowly turned the hole
>> >>>> assmebly just slightly listening to what sounded best. when It
>> >>>> sounded good, I tightened the bolts back up. I must have got it
>> >>>> right cause my sister has the car now and it has well over
>> >>>> 240,000 miles now.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> my 2 cents
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Dave
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> The only way to go on high mileage vehicles. Often, a timing
>> >>> light is useless in such situations. Been doing it by
>> >>> "feel/sound" for years...
>> >>>
>> >>> JT
>> >> Mostly, that works well. An exception is when the distributor is
>> >> failing and the timing is erratic - there is no correct setting
>> >> then, and a timing light will show the timing is jumping around.
>> >> The timing light is a great diagnostic help for that, as it points
>> >> a big red arrow at the distributor. Of course, if there is
>> >> anything seriously wrong with the fuel or valves the timing can't
>> >> be set by ear (and sometimes not even set quite right with a
>> >> light) because the operation is never right.
>> >>
>> >> Mike
>> >
>> >
>> > A failing distributor should be pretty easy to catch. Of course, I
>> > working with relatively primitive cars (the newest being the '83
>> > Civic).
>> > Valve problems hopefully would be on the noisy side.
>> >
>> > I'm used to the simpler old style vacuum advance distributors where
>> > the timing was set with the vacuum disconnected. One could then
>> > use a timing light to check the rate of advance when applying the
>> > gas pedal. Easy task on an old V8 where everything is out in the
>> > open.
>> >
>> > On my '83 Civic, the long sleep that it endured left the whole
>> > vacuum-electro-mechanical control system in some disarray. For
>> > example,
>> > when I first got the car running in May, the spark would advance
>> > by
>> > turning the distributor counter clockwise which is the opposite of
>> > what the manual calls for. Later, it would not respond at all and
>> > now it seems to work (somewhat) as it should.
>> >
>> > The vacuum for the advance is tapped of of the carb insulator which
>> > is of course below the butterfly. Since manifold vacuum decreases
>> > when the butterfly(s) are opened, how would this advance timing.
>> > The vacuum line is a "T" with the other line going to "Control Box
>> > 1."
>> >
>> > <shudder>
>> >
>> > JT
>> >
>> > (Amazed by those crafty Japanese engineers...)
>>
>> the 93 civic has neither vacuum advance not centrifugal weights -
>> it's all electronically controlled with timing maps stored in the
>> ecu.
>
>
> Which in turn limits the ability to resolve issues by the consumer. I
> suppose (or hope) that failures are rare with Hondas. Detroit junk
> OTOH, could cause a lot of sleepless nights...
>
> JT
>

You can always get a Hondata programmable ECU,and a laptop will allow you
to reconfigure as you wish.

--
Jim Yanik
jyanik
at
kua.net

 

Grumpy AuContraire <Grumpster@GrumpyvilleNOT.com> wrote in
news:44FF87BE.88CB2DB8@GrumpyvilleNOT.com:

>
>
> jim beam wrote:
>>
>> Grumpy AuContraire wrote:
>> >
>> > Michael Pardee wrote:
>> >> "Grumpy AuContraire" <Grumpster@GrumpyvilleNOT.com> wrote in
>> >> message news:44FE5B25.DCB76BBD@GrumpyvilleNOT.com...
>> >>>
>> >>> Zephyr wrote:
>> >>>> I had to replace the distributer on my 93 civic 5 years ago when
>> >>>> the bearing went bad. I took the old one out and popped in a
>> >>>> new one, without making carefull note of the allignment. just
>> >>>> as you describe with yours, the car was a pig when I started it
>> >>>> up. it also sounded rough. I loosened the bolts on the
>> >>>> distibuter, started the car up and slowly turned the hole
>> >>>> assmebly just slightly listening to what sounded best. when It
>> >>>> sounded good, I tightened the bolts back up. I must have got it
>> >>>> right cause my sister has the car now and it has well over
>> >>>> 240,000 miles now.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> my 2 cents
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Dave
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> The only way to go on high mileage vehicles. Often, a timing
>> >>> light is useless in such situations. Been doing it by
>> >>> "feel/sound" for years...
>> >>>
>> >>> JT
>> >> Mostly, that works well. An exception is when the distributor is
>> >> failing and the timing is erratic - there is no correct setting
>> >> then, and a timing light will show the timing is jumping around.
>> >> The timing light is a great diagnostic help for that, as it points
>> >> a big red arrow at the distributor. Of course, if there is
>> >> anything seriously wrong with the fuel or valves the timing can't
>> >> be set by ear (and sometimes not even set quite right with a
>> >> light) because the operation is never right.
>> >>
>> >> Mike
>> >
>> >
>> > A failing distributor should be pretty easy to catch. Of course, I
>> > working with relatively primitive cars (the newest being the '83
>> > Civic).
>> > Valve problems hopefully would be on the noisy side.
>> >
>> > I'm used to the simpler old style vacuum advance distributors where
>> > the timing was set with the vacuum disconnected. One could then
>> > use a timing light to check the rate of advance when applying the
>> > gas pedal. Easy task on an old V8 where everything is out in the
>> > open.
>> >
>> > On my '83 Civic, the long sleep that it endured left the whole
>> > vacuum-electro-mechanical control system in some disarray. For
>> > example,
>> > when I first got the car running in May, the spark would advance
>> > by
>> > turning the distributor counter clockwise which is the opposite of
>> > what the manual calls for. Later, it would not respond at all and
>> > now it seems to work (somewhat) as it should.
>> >
>> > The vacuum for the advance is tapped of of the carb insulator which
>> > is of course below the butterfly. Since manifold vacuum decreases
>> > when the butterfly(s) are opened, how would this advance timing.
>> > The vacuum line is a "T" with the other line going to "Control Box
>> > 1."
>> >
>> > <shudder>
>> >
>> > JT
>> >
>> > (Amazed by those crafty Japanese engineers...)
>>
>> the 93 civic has neither vacuum advance not centrifugal weights -
>> it's all electronically controlled with timing maps stored in the
>> ecu.
>
>
> Which in turn limits the ability to resolve issues by the consumer. I
> suppose (or hope) that failures are rare with Hondas. Detroit junk
> OTOH, could cause a lot of sleepless nights...
>
> JT
>

You can always get a Hondata programmable ECU,and a laptop will allow you
to reconfigure as you wish.

--
Jim Yanik
jyanik
at
kua.net

 

jim beam <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote in
news:Mt2dnUGLs_a452LZnZ2dnUVZ_rSdnZ2d@speakeasy.ne t:



>
> the 93 civic has neither vacuum advance not centrifugal weights - it's
> all electronically controlled with timing maps stored in the ecu.

Less to go wrong or wear out. Good.
Follows the KISS principle!

--
Jim Yanik
jyanik
at
kua.net

 

jim beam <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote in
news:Mt2dnUGLs_a452LZnZ2dnUVZ_rSdnZ2d@speakeasy.ne t:



>
> the 93 civic has neither vacuum advance not centrifugal weights - it's
> all electronically controlled with timing maps stored in the ecu.

Less to go wrong or wear out. Good.
Follows the KISS principle!

--
Jim Yanik
jyanik
at
kua.net