Re: 2008 minivans: Honda Odyssey vs Toyota Sienna
 

On 2008-07-20, dbu <nospam@nospam.moc> wrote:
> In article <slrng854vb.c5q.joe@barada.griffincs.local>,
> Joe <joe@nospam.hits-buffalo.com> wrote:
>
>> On 2008-07-19, badgolferman <REMOVETHISbadgolferman@gmail.com> wrote:
>> > dbu, 7/19/2008,4:41:44 PM, wrote:
>> >
>> >> I'd love to see the look on this cussing fools face when he
>> >> finds out I tell truth.
>> >
>> > dbu, I think this all stems from the use of the word "super" to
>> > describe midgrade gasoline. Most of us use "super" when referring to
>> > the highest grade however it is probably more correct to call it
>> > "premium" and I am guessing that is what you know 91-93 octane gasoline
>> > as. I can believe you have a station that would charge a penney more
>> > for 89 octane gas, especially if it is an independent station where it
>> > receives its supply from a local refiner. You don't have to defend
>> > yourself or prove anything since it is obvious they won't believe you
>> > even if you did post a picture. They will accuse you of doctoring it
>> > or having the owner change the prices just for your picture.
>> >
>>
>> Actually, that's my main problem with his "story". I can't imagine a
>> region ANYWHERE that doesn't have 91/93 octane fuel, as dbu states.
>> That would mean that people like me can't drive there, as the fuel
>> isn't high enough octane for my car...
>
> I'm not saying there is none, I'm saying that I have not seen any except
> for the non-oxygenated premium fuel for lawn mowers etc and classic
> cars. You would have to look and plan ahead I guess.
>
> What kind of car do you drive that requires such a high octane, Piper or
> Cessina maybe? I don't think you'll have any problem finding av-gas at
> 110 octane.

A requirement of 91 Octane is fairly normal for a great variety of
high performance vehicles. I drive a Civic Si. It is but one of many
with such a requirement...


--
Joe - Linux User #449481/Ubuntu User #19733
joe at hits - buffalo dot com
"Hate is baggage, life is too short to go around pissed off all the
time..." - Danny, American History X

Re: 2008 minivans: Honda Odyssey vs Toyota Sienna
 

In article <slrng85q99.jr2.joe@barada.griffincs.local>,
Joe <joe@nospam.hits-buffalo.com> wrote:

> On 2008-07-20, dbu <nospam@nospam.moc> wrote:
> > In article <slrng854vb.c5q.joe@barada.griffincs.local>,
> > Joe <joe@nospam.hits-buffalo.com> wrote:
> >
> >> On 2008-07-19, badgolferman <REMOVETHISbadgolferman@gmail.com> wrote:
> >> > dbu, 7/19/2008,4:41:44 PM, wrote:
> >> >
> >> >> I'd love to see the look on this cussing fools face when he
> >> >> finds out I tell truth.
> >> >
> >> > dbu, I think this all stems from the use of the word "super" to
> >> > describe midgrade gasoline. Most of us use "super" when referring to
> >> > the highest grade however it is probably more correct to call it
> >> > "premium" and I am guessing that is what you know 91-93 octane gasoline
> >> > as. I can believe you have a station that would charge a penney more
> >> > for 89 octane gas, especially if it is an independent station where it
> >> > receives its supply from a local refiner. You don't have to defend
> >> > yourself or prove anything since it is obvious they won't believe you
> >> > even if you did post a picture. They will accuse you of doctoring it
> >> > or having the owner change the prices just for your picture.
> >> >
> >>
> >> Actually, that's my main problem with his "story". I can't imagine a
> >> region ANYWHERE that doesn't have 91/93 octane fuel, as dbu states.
> >> That would mean that people like me can't drive there, as the fuel
> >> isn't high enough octane for my car...
> >
> > I'm not saying there is none, I'm saying that I have not seen any except
> > for the non-oxygenated premium fuel for lawn mowers etc and classic
> > cars. You would have to look and plan ahead I guess.
> >
> > What kind of car do you drive that requires such a high octane, Piper or
> > Cessina maybe? I don't think you'll have any problem finding av-gas at
> > 110 octane.
>
> A requirement of 91 Octane is fairly normal for a great variety of
> high performance vehicles. I drive a Civic Si. It is but one of many
> with such a requirement...

Ok, but seems to me there was a few years ago, octane number varied
according to ethanol mix or not, I just don't remember. Nobody that I
know uses 91 octane. If there was 20 cents difference between reg and
premium or as my favorite station calls it "super" then I would buy
regular, but it's not. When I visit the next state over their fuel
prices tend to be higher especially along the interstate. I always buy
regular because of the price difference.
--

Re: 2008 minivans: Honda Odyssey vs Toyota Sienna
 

dbu <nospam@nospam.moc> writes:

> 89 is called super. We have strict regulations here so do not worry,
> it's not scam. 87 is regular and 89 is called premium or "super". I
> don't know of gas stations here that offer 91 or, wow, 93!!

I may have seen 89 may be called super in some areas, but not here.
It's midgrade, and 91 is super.

--
Todd H.
2008 Sienna LE (AL QF RL TO CF)
Chicago, Illinois USA

Re: 2008 minivans: Honda Odyssey vs Toyota Sienna
 

Todd H. wrote:
> dbu <nospam@nospam.moc> writes:
>
>> 89 is called super. We have strict regulations here so do not worry,
>> it's not scam. 87 is regular and 89 is called premium or "super". I
>> don't know of gas stations here that offer 91 or, wow, 93!!
>
> I may have seen 89 may be called super in some areas, but not here.
> It's midgrade, and 91 is super.
>
> --
> Todd H.
> 2008 Sienna LE (AL QF RL TO CF)
> Chicago, Illinois USA
Hi,
I just came back from Baltic cruise. Over there in Northern europe gas
has two grade, Octane 92 or 95. Lot of small peppy cars on the street
which my need higher Octane gasoline. Worst price was in Denmark, over
3.00 per liter. Up here in Canada it's Regular(87), Premium(89) and
Super(92)

Re: 2008 minivans: Honda Odyssey vs Toyota Sienna
 

On Sun, 20 Jul 2008 15:24:58 GMT, Tony Hwang <dragon40@shaw.ca> wrote:

>Hi,
>I just came back from Baltic cruise. Over there in Northern europe gas
>has two grade, Octane 92 or 95. Lot of small peppy cars on the street
>which my need higher Octane gasoline. Worst price was in Denmark, over
>3.00 per liter. Up here in Canada it's Regular(87), Premium(89) and
>Super(92)

Remember, Europe uses a different octane rating - there are two
systems. And the US averages the Research Octane and Motor Octane
results to get the number we put on the pump.

--<< Bruce >>--

Re: 2008 minivans: Honda Odyssey vs Toyota Sienna
 

Tony Hwang, 7/20/2008,11:24:58 AM, wrote:

> Up here in Canada it's Regular(87), Premium(89) and Super(92)

You're sure it's in that order?

Re: 2008 minivans: Honda Odyssey vs Toyota Sienna
 

Consumer Reports says Sienna gets 19 in mixed driving just like my Odyssey.
Unfortunately I drive mostly around town in it and not on highway so it
averages Odyssey averages 17. Meanwhile my wife gets easily 34 in Camry
hybrid, city or highway, just as EPA figures indicated.


"badgolferman" <REMOVETHISbadgolferman@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:xn0fss2gearbui7000@news.mixmin.net...
> dbu, 7/17/2008,5:54:16 AM, wrote:
>
>> The Sienna gets 25-28 MPG.
>
> This is hard for me to believe.

Re: 2008 minivans: Honda Odyssey vs Toyota Sienna
 

Figures match my 2006 Odyssey perfectly.


"Siskuwihane" <Siskuwihane1@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:b1c62226-9512-4c81-8bb9-b9bad8d66fc3@y38g2000hsy.googlegroups.com...
On Jul 17, 6:27 am, "badgolferman" <REMOVETHISbadgolfer...@gmail.com>
wrote:
> dbu, 7/17/2008,5:54:16 AM, wrote:
> > The Sienna gets 25-28 MPG.
>
> This is hard for me to believe.

It may get that on a long trip, but for day-to-day driving...

From Consumer guide Automotive

Forget the EPA. Consumer Guide's auto editors drove 150,000 miles
last year. We drove to work, to day care, to the grocery store, and on
vacation. We drove through record heat, blinding snow, driving rain,
and confounding road construction, keeping track of every drop of fuel
we used along the way.

The EPA admits its fuel economy numbers are estimates. Our numbers are
real. A typical Consumer Guide test car is evaluated by at least four
editors, all of whom account for their individual fuel usage. Here are
the vehicles in each class that used the least amount of fuel while in
our care.

Honda Odyssey-16.4 MPG

Toyota Sienna-16.4 MPG

http://consumerguideauto.howstuffwor...-champions.htm

Consumer Reports faired a little better with 19 MPG.

As one poster noted about the Odyssey

"my normal gas mileage is 17 mpg in the city and 24.5-25 mpg on the
highway. I've gotten as low as 15 mpg in the winter here (10% ethanol
fuel) and as high as 27.1 mpg on the highway (traveling by myself with
just two suitcases). I keep my tires at 37 psi, which is what made my
gas mileage increase by 1-2 mpg."

Another noted about his Sienna " I drive 80MPH and still get 24 MPG"
which I will dismiss as total BS.

Re: 2008 minivans: Honda Odyssey vs Toyota Sienna
 

My Odyssey has a onboard computer that I verify every fill up. It gets 17
around city. Never better around town. End I have the more efficient
engine that turns off 3 cylinders during coasting. I believe they may have
a new version that can turn off 4 cyclinders in the Accord. Not sure if it
is in the Odyssey though.



"dbu" <nospam@nospam.moc> wrote in message
news:nospam-E5B324.17415617072008@comcast.dca.giganews.com...
> In article <YoGdnWHyQ7_JVeLVnZ2dnUVZ_vWdnZ2d@ptd.net>,
> "Mike hunt" <mikehunt22@lycos.com> wrote:
>
>> If one owns a vehicle that has an onboard fuel computer you will discover
>> they most efficient speed to drive is around 70 MPH, not 60 MPH. At 75
>> it
>> is only a mile or two less but still two or three more than when I drive
>> 55
>> MPH.
>>
>> "Siskuwihane" <Siskuwihane1@gmail.com> wrote in message
>> news:b1c62226-9512-4c81-8bb9-b9bad8d66fc3@y38g2000hsy.googlegroups.com...
>> On Jul 17, 6:27 am, "badgolferman" <REMOVETHISbadgolfer...@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>> > dbu, 7/17/2008,5:54:16 AM, wrote:
>> > > The Sienna gets 25-28 MPG.
>> >
>> > This is hard for me to believe.
>>
>> It may get that on a long trip, but for day-to-day driving...
>>
>> From Consumer guide Automotive
>>
>> Forget the EPA. Consumer Guide's auto editors drove 150,000 miles
>> last year. We drove to work, to day care, to the grocery store, and on
>> vacation. We drove through record heat, blinding snow, driving rain,
>> and confounding road construction, keeping track of every drop of fuel
>> we used along the way.
>>
>> The EPA admits its fuel economy numbers are estimates. Our numbers are
>> real. A typical Consumer Guide test car is evaluated by at least four
>> editors, all of whom account for their individual fuel usage. Here are
>> the vehicles in each class that used the least amount of fuel while in
>> our care.
>>
>> Honda Odyssey-16.4 MPG
>>
>> Toyota Sienna-16.4 MPG
>
> That's not what I'm getting. I own and drive a Sienna and I calculate
> over a number of trips my gas mileage. If anyone chooses to not believe
> me, fine, I don't care. I know what I get in gas mileage and that is
> all that matters to me. My friend who has a 08 Ody gets even better gas
> mileage and he is conservative and flat honest, if he didn't get what he
> gets he would say so.
>
>
>>
>> http://consumerguideauto.howstuffwor...-champions.htm
>>
>> Consumer Reports faired a little better with 19 MPG.
>>
>> As one poster noted about the Odyssey
>>
>> "my normal gas mileage is 17 mpg in the city and 24.5-25 mpg on the
>> highway. I've gotten as low as 15 mpg in the winter here (10% ethanol
>> fuel) and as high as 27.1 mpg on the highway (traveling by myself with
>> just two suitcases). I keep my tires at 37 psi, which is what made my
>> gas mileage increase by 1-2 mpg."
>>
>> Another noted about his Sienna " I drive 80MPH and still get 24 MPG"
>> which I will dismiss as total BS.
> --
>
>
>
>

Re: 2008 minivans: Honda Odyssey vs Toyota Sienna
 

Art wrote:
> My Odyssey has a onboard computer that I verify every fill up. It gets 17
> around city. Never better around town. End I have the more efficient
> engine that turns off 3 cylinders during coasting. I believe they may have
> a new version that can turn off 4 cyclinders in the Accord. Not sure if it
> is in the Odyssey though.

/all/ modern fuel injected cars turn of /all/ cylinders when coasting.

it's /some/ cars that turn off cylinders when /cruising/.


>
>
>
> "dbu" <nospam@nospam.moc> wrote in message
> news:nospam-E5B324.17415617072008@comcast.dca.giganews.com...
>> In article <YoGdnWHyQ7_JVeLVnZ2dnUVZ_vWdnZ2d@ptd.net>,
>> "Mike hunt" <mikehunt22@lycos.com> wrote:
>>
>>> If one owns a vehicle that has an onboard fuel computer you will discover
>>> they most efficient speed to drive is around 70 MPH, not 60 MPH. At 75
>>> it
>>> is only a mile or two less but still two or three more than when I drive
>>> 55
>>> MPH.
>>>
>>> "Siskuwihane" <Siskuwihane1@gmail.com> wrote in message
>>> news:b1c62226-9512-4c81-8bb9-b9bad8d66fc3@y38g2000hsy.googlegroups.com...
>>> On Jul 17, 6:27 am, "badgolferman" <REMOVETHISbadgolfer...@gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>> dbu, 7/17/2008,5:54:16 AM, wrote:
>>>>> The Sienna gets 25-28 MPG.
>>>> This is hard for me to believe.
>>> It may get that on a long trip, but for day-to-day driving...
>>>
>>> From Consumer guide Automotive
>>>
>>> Forget the EPA. Consumer Guide's auto editors drove 150,000 miles
>>> last year. We drove to work, to day care, to the grocery store, and on
>>> vacation. We drove through record heat, blinding snow, driving rain,
>>> and confounding road construction, keeping track of every drop of fuel
>>> we used along the way.
>>>
>>> The EPA admits its fuel economy numbers are estimates. Our numbers are
>>> real. A typical Consumer Guide test car is evaluated by at least four
>>> editors, all of whom account for their individual fuel usage. Here are
>>> the vehicles in each class that used the least amount of fuel while in
>>> our care.
>>>
>>> Honda Odyssey-16.4 MPG
>>>
>>> Toyota Sienna-16.4 MPG
>> That's not what I'm getting. I own and drive a Sienna and I calculate
>> over a number of trips my gas mileage. If anyone chooses to not believe
>> me, fine, I don't care. I know what I get in gas mileage and that is
>> all that matters to me. My friend who has a 08 Ody gets even better gas
>> mileage and he is conservative and flat honest, if he didn't get what he
>> gets he would say so.
>>
>>
>>> http://consumerguideauto.howstuffwor...-champions.htm
>>>
>>> Consumer Reports faired a little better with 19 MPG.
>>>
>>> As one poster noted about the Odyssey
>>>
>>> "my normal gas mileage is 17 mpg in the city and 24.5-25 mpg on the
>>> highway. I've gotten as low as 15 mpg in the winter here (10% ethanol
>>> fuel) and as high as 27.1 mpg on the highway (traveling by myself with
>>> just two suitcases). I keep my tires at 37 psi, which is what made my
>>> gas mileage increase by 1-2 mpg."
>>>
>>> Another noted about his Sienna " I drive 80MPH and still get 24 MPG"
>>> which I will dismiss as total BS.
>> --
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>

Re: 2008 minivans: Honda Odyssey vs Toyota Sienna
 

In article <BsednVLDB-BcSB7VnZ2dnUVZ_qbinZ2d@earthlink.com>,
"Art" <begunaNOSPAMPLEASE@mindspring.com> wrote:

> Consumer Reports says Sienna gets 19 in mixed driving just like my Odyssey.
> Unfortunately I drive mostly around town in it and not on highway so it
> averages Odyssey averages 17. Meanwhile my wife gets easily 34 in Camry
> hybrid, city or highway, just as EPA figures indicated.


My Sienna gets 25-28 on a trip. It may be hard for people to believe,
but not for me as I own and drive one and have checked it on more than
one trip. That is the way it is.
--

Re: 2008 minivans: Honda Odyssey vs Toyota Sienna
 

On Sun, 20 Jul 2008 17:44:20 -0700, jim beam
<spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote:

>Art wrote:
>> My Odyssey has a onboard computer that I verify every fill up. It gets 17
>> around city. Never better around town. End I have the more efficient
>> engine that turns off 3 cylinders during coasting. I believe they may have
>> a new version that can turn off 4 cyclinders in the Accord. Not sure if it
>> is in the Odyssey though.
>
>/all/ modern fuel injected cars turn of /all/ cylinders when coasting.
>
>it's /some/ cars that turn off cylinders when /cruising/.
>
>
snip

Mind explaining what you mean? By coasting do you mean rolling with
the gear shift in neutral? If that is what you mean is engine cut out
in this condition a requirement of North American autos as it
certainly isn't so for European vehicles. In Europe it is becoming
increasingly common for modern vehicles to stop the engine when at
rest and for the engine to restart when the gas pedal (accelerator) is
depressed.

Re: 2008 minivans: Honda Odyssey vs Toyota Sienna
 

Edward W. Thompson wrote:
> On Sun, 20 Jul 2008 17:44:20 -0700, jim beam
> <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote:
>
>> Art wrote:
>>> My Odyssey has a onboard computer that I verify every fill up. It gets 17
>>> around city. Never better around town. End I have the more efficient
>>> engine that turns off 3 cylinders during coasting. I believe they may have
>>> a new version that can turn off 4 cyclinders in the Accord. Not sure if it
>>> is in the Odyssey though.
>> /all/ modern fuel injected cars turn of /all/ cylinders when coasting.
>>
>> it's /some/ cars that turn off cylinders when /cruising/.
>>
>>
> snip
>
> Mind explaining what you mean? By coasting do you mean rolling with
> the gear shift in neutral?

no, coasting is when the momentum of the vehicle pushes against the
engine and turns it even when you have your foot off the gas, like
descending a hill or slowing to a stop.


> If that is what you mean is engine cut out
> in this condition a requirement of North American autos as it
> certainly isn't so for European vehicles.

no, it's for all electronic fuel injection vehicles, globally. the
forward energy of the vehicle is rotating the engine - there's no point
injecting gas when the motor's just pumping air coasting.


> In Europe it is becoming
> increasingly common for modern vehicles to stop the engine when at
> rest and for the engine to restart when the gas pedal (accelerator) is
> depressed.

that's not coasting.

Re: 2008 minivans: Honda Odyssey vs Toyota Sienna
 

On Jul 21, 1:30 am, jim beam <spamvor...@bad.example.net> wrote:

>
> > Mind explaining what you mean? By coasting do you mean rolling with
> > the gear shift in neutral?
>
> no, coasting is when the momentum of the vehicle pushes against the
> engine and turns it even when you have your foot off the gas, like
> descending a hill or slowing to a stop.
>
> > If that is what you mean is engine cut out
> > in this condition a requirement of North American autos as it
> > certainly isn't so for European vehicles.
>
> no, it's for all electronic fuel injection vehicles, globally. the
> forward energy of the vehicle is rotating the engine - there's no point
> injecting gas when the motor's just pumping air coasting.
>
> > In Europe it is becoming
> > increasingly common for modern vehicles to stop the engine when at
> > rest and for the engine to restart when the gas pedal (accelerator) is
> > depressed.
>
> that's not coasting.

Uh boy, another topic introduced! ;-)

Re: the regular/super debate - here in NJ, we have regular (87), plus
(89) and super (91/93). My Audi A4 turbo requires "super" - 91 octane
- although I have run it with no issues on 89. My wife actually filled
it with regular (87) once and it definitely was down on power. Don't
recall the gas mileage (although I have it in my log). I can imagine
some small towns (which is where I assume dbu lives) which don't carry
all 3 grades. I've seen that in Maine, but if they have 87 and 89,
it's still labeled 'regular' and 'plus', not 'super' for 89. And who
uses 'Super' for their lawnmowers, etc?? I use the cheapest crap I can
find, just like for the Odyssey. ;-) I filled it up yesterday for
$3.83 (full serve, too, which is all we have in NJ).

Dan D
Central NJ USA

Re: 2008 minivans: Honda Odyssey vs Toyota Sienna
 

"Joe" <joe@nospam.hits-buffalo.com> wrote in message
news:slrng854vb.c5q.joe@barada.griffincs.local...
> On 2008-07-19, badgolferman <REMOVETHISbadgolferman@gmail.com> wrote:
>> dbu, 7/19/2008,4:41:44 PM, wrote:
>>
>>> I'd love to see the look on this cussing fools face when he
>>> finds out I tell truth.
>>
>> dbu, I think this all stems from the use of the word "super" to
>> describe midgrade gasoline. Most of us use "super" when referring to
>> the highest grade however it is probably more correct to call it
>> "premium" and I am guessing that is what you know 91-93 octane gasoline
>> as. I can believe you have a station that would charge a penney more
>> for 89 octane gas, especially if it is an independent station where it
>> receives its supply from a local refiner. You don't have to defend
>> yourself or prove anything since it is obvious they won't believe you
>> even if you did post a picture. They will accuse you of doctoring it
>> or having the owner change the prices just for your picture.
>>
>
> Actually, that's my main problem with his "story". I can't imagine a
> region ANYWHERE that doesn't have 91/93 octane fuel, as dbu states.
> That would mean that people like me can't drive there, as the fuel
> isn't high enough octane for my car...
>
>
Actually, I was in Colorado a couple of weeks ago, and all the gas there
seemed to be a couple of points lower in octane than what I'm used to in
Texas. I don't know why -- something to do with the altitude, maybe? Alas, I
have no photos to support my assertion.