Re: 2008 minivans: Honda Odyssey vs Toyota Sienna
 

In article <pan.2008.07.18.00.55.44.87402@moria2.lan>,
Dan C <youmustbejoking@lan.invalid> wrote:

> On Thu, 17 Jul 2008 19:05:08 -0500, dbu wrote:
>
> > Where I gas up at there is a penny difference between their reg. and
> > their premium.
>
> I don't believe that. Not at a normal gas station, anyway.
>
> > I always gas up my Sienna with the premium. I can tell the difference
> > in performance as I've tried both.
>
> I don't believe that, either. You are under the illusion that many people
> are, that premium is more "powerful". It isn't.
>
> > Not a blow you away difference, but a difference. I expect gas mileage
> > is somewhat better with premium also, but I've never tested it.
>
> There is no difference.
>
>
> > When I gas up in the next state over that does not have state mandated
> > ethanol based fuel I see even better performance.
>
> As has been previously stated, that is because ethanol does not have the
> same energy (BTU) per gallon that gasoline does. It has less.
>
> > I'm still trying to understand where we as drivers of gas vehicles have
> > any advantage using ethanol fuel.
>
> We don't. It's a purely political sham, and is not a good thing at all.
> What it's basically doing is driving up the prices of food that uses corn,
> which is a lot more foods than most people realize.

I need not waste my time as I have no need to convince anyone. I know
what I get for mileage, I know what I feel in performance difference and
that is all that matters to me. The gas station is an independent and
what I said is true.
--

Re: 2008 minivans: Honda Odyssey vs Toyota Sienna
 

On Fri, 18 Jul 2008 07:00:07 -0500, dbu wrote:

> I need not waste my time as I have no need to convince anyone. I know
> what I get for mileage, I know what I feel in performance difference and
> that is all that matters to me. The gas station is an independent and
> what I said is true.

Your mileage and performance dreams are just wishful thinking, and
indicative of what a person can convince themselves of, if they want to.

As for the gas station... Everywhere else in the country, gas stations
(independent or not) usually charge an average of 20 cents more for
Premium than for Regular. Yet you expect people to believe that in your
special place, they only charge 1 cent more. Sorry, it's just too much of
a difference to be believed.

How about you provide a link to a picture of their sign out front, which
shows the prices...? Can you do that?


--
"Ubuntu" -- an African word, meaning "Slackware is too hard for me".
The Usenet Improvement Project: http://improve-usenet.org

Re: 2008 minivans: Honda Odyssey vs Toyota Sienna
 

"dbu" <nospam@nospam.moc> wrote in message
news:nospam-7980EE.19050817072008@comcast.dca.giganews.com...
> In article <slrng7vlck.85v.joe@barada.griffincs.local>,
> Joe <joe@nospam.hits-buffalo.com> wrote:
>
>> On 2008-07-17, dbu <nospam@nospam.moc> wrote:
>> > In article <pan.2008.07.17.17.46.25.114350@moria2.lan>,
>> > Dan C <youmustbejoking@lan.invalid> wrote:
>> >
>> >> On Thu, 17 Jul 2008 17:06:27 +0000, badgolferman wrote:
>> >>
>> >> > I can see it doing that well on a trip if you're using super
>> >> > unleaded
>> >> > gasoline.
>> >>
>> >> Horsefeathers. The grade of gasoline has NOTHING to do with how much
>> >> mileage you get.
>> >
>> > I get slightly poorer mileage with ethanol based fuel.
>>
>> That will always be true, as Ethanol doesn't have as much energy as
>> Petrol, but there will be no difference between Super and Regular
>> unleaded. Use what the car needs. My Civic Si requires Premium. If
>> your car doesn't, don't bother using it. It does nothing for you.
>
> Where I gas up at there is a penny difference between their reg. and
> their premium. I always gas up my Sienna with the premium. I can tell
> the difference in performance as I've tried both. Not a blow you away
> difference, but a difference. I expect gas mileage is somewhat better
> with premium also, but I've never tested it. When I gas up in the next
> state over that does not have state mandated ethanol based fuel I see
> even better performance. I'm still trying to understand where we as
> drivers of gas vehicles have any advantage using ethanol fuel.
> --
>

Supposedly the ethanol is in there to "oxygenate" the fuel (ethanol contains
oxygen, gasoline doesn't) in order to make it burn cleaner. Refiners used to
add something called MTBE to gas for this purpose, but the MTBE ended up
leaking out of tanks and contaminating groundwater, hence the switch.

Ethanol does have a lower energy density than gasoline, so you can expect to
see slightly poorer mileage with fuel containing ethanol than with
non-ethanol fuell.

If I could get "premium" for a penny more per gallon than regular, I'd use
premium too. In more than 35 years of driving, I've never seen that.

Re: 2008 minivans: Honda Odyssey vs Toyota Sienna
 

I'd love to have a gas station that only charges 1 cent more for
super, as my Audi uses that (although I do mix in a tank of 'plus' on
a regular basis. I can't notice much difference in performance or
mileage).

My Odyssey EX averages just under 17 mpg in town and I have gotten as
high as 25 on the highway - the usual is 23. That's generally with a
pretty loaded car (5 people plus dog and luggage) and the cruise set
for 76-ish. I'm happy with that. Our old Ford Crapstar used to get 15
in town, 20 on the highway and was a piece of besides. ;-)

Dan D
'07 Ody EX
Central NJ USA

Re: 2008 minivans: Honda Odyssey vs Toyota Sienna
 

In article <BG0gk.18295$N87.7310@nlpi068.nbdc.sbc.com>,
"Paul" <pkmueller@sbcglobal.net> wrote:

> "dbu" <nospam@nospam.moc> wrote in message
> news:nospam-7980EE.19050817072008@comcast.dca.giganews.com...
> > In article <slrng7vlck.85v.joe@barada.griffincs.local>,
> > Joe <joe@nospam.hits-buffalo.com> wrote:
> >
> >> On 2008-07-17, dbu <nospam@nospam.moc> wrote:
> >> > In article <pan.2008.07.17.17.46.25.114350@moria2.lan>,
> >> > Dan C <youmustbejoking@lan.invalid> wrote:
> >> >
> >> >> On Thu, 17 Jul 2008 17:06:27 +0000, badgolferman wrote:
> >> >>
> >> >> > I can see it doing that well on a trip if you're using super
> >> >> > unleaded
> >> >> > gasoline.
> >> >>
> >> >> Horsefeathers. The grade of gasoline has NOTHING to do with how much
> >> >> mileage you get.
> >> >
> >> > I get slightly poorer mileage with ethanol based fuel.
> >>
> >> That will always be true, as Ethanol doesn't have as much energy as
> >> Petrol, but there will be no difference between Super and Regular
> >> unleaded. Use what the car needs. My Civic Si requires Premium. If
> >> your car doesn't, don't bother using it. It does nothing for you.
> >
> > Where I gas up at there is a penny difference between their reg. and
> > their premium. I always gas up my Sienna with the premium. I can tell
> > the difference in performance as I've tried both. Not a blow you away
> > difference, but a difference. I expect gas mileage is somewhat better
> > with premium also, but I've never tested it. When I gas up in the next
> > state over that does not have state mandated ethanol based fuel I see
> > even better performance. I'm still trying to understand where we as
> > drivers of gas vehicles have any advantage using ethanol fuel.
> > --
> >
>
> Supposedly the ethanol is in there to "oxygenate" the fuel (ethanol contains
> oxygen, gasoline doesn't) in order to make it burn cleaner. Refiners used to
> add something called MTBE to gas for this purpose, but the MTBE ended up
> leaking out of tanks and contaminating groundwater, hence the switch.
>
> Ethanol does have a lower energy density than gasoline, so you can expect to
> see slightly poorer mileage with fuel containing ethanol than with
> non-ethanol fuell.
>
> If I could get "premium" for a penny more per gallon than regular, I'd use
> premium too. In more than 35 years of driving, I've never seen that.

Is your email address good? If so I'll try and get you a picture.
--

Re: 2008 minivans: Honda Odyssey vs Toyota Sienna
 

In article
<e52e786a-5ea8-4f97-8f56-32df82cdcf1f@q24g2000prf.googlegroups.com>,
Dano58 <dan.dibiase@gmail.com> wrote:

> I'd love to have a gas station that only charges 1 cent more for
> super, as my Audi uses that (although I do mix in a tank of 'plus' on
> a regular basis. I can't notice much difference in performance or
> mileage).
>
> My Odyssey EX averages just under 17 mpg in town and I have gotten as
> high as 25 on the highway - the usual is 23. That's generally with a
> pretty loaded car (5 people plus dog and luggage) and the cruise set
> for 76-ish. I'm happy with that. Our old Ford Crapstar used to get 15
> in town, 20 on the highway and was a piece of besides. ;-)
>
> Dan D
> '07 Ody EX
> Central NJ USA

I just talked to my buddy who has a 08 Ody which uses only three
cylinders while on longer trips and he said he gets 32.5 MPG but that
was using S.D. premium gas, wind at back and driving the speed limit, 65
mph with a steady foot. Sadly, today so many people have a very heavy
foot, I see it all the time in city traffic and on the long highway
trips. If drivers would learn to drive like they have an egg under the
gas pedal and hold the speed down to 65 or so, they would see much
better gas mileage, also keep those tires inflated.
--

Re: 2008 minivans: Honda Odyssey vs Toyota Sienna
 

In article <pan.2008.07.18.12.55.43.923527@moria2.lan>,
Dan C <youmustbejoking@lan.invalid> wrote:

> On Fri, 18 Jul 2008 07:00:07 -0500, dbu wrote:
>
> > I need not waste my time as I have no need to convince anyone. I know
> > what I get for mileage, I know what I feel in performance difference and
> > that is all that matters to me. The gas station is an independent and
> > what I said is true.
>
> Your mileage and performance dreams are just wishful thinking, and
> indicative of what a person can convince themselves of, if they want to.
>
> As for the gas station... Everywhere else in the country, gas stations
> (independent or not) usually charge an average of 20 cents more for
> Premium than for Regular. Yet you expect people to believe that in your
> special place, they only charge 1 cent more. Sorry, it's just too much of
> a difference to be believed.
>
> How about you provide a link to a picture of their sign out front, which
> shows the prices...? Can you do that?

Your email?
--

Re: 2008 minivans: Honda Odyssey vs Toyota Sienna
 

"dbu" <nospam@nospam.moc> wrote in message
news:nospam-113FFE.11344318072008@comcast.dca.giganews.com...
> In article <pan.2008.07.18.12.55.43.923527@moria2.lan>,
> Dan C <youmustbejoking@lan.invalid> wrote:
>
>> On Fri, 18 Jul 2008 07:00:07 -0500, dbu wrote:
>>
>> > I need not waste my time as I have no need to convince anyone. I know
>> > what I get for mileage, I know what I feel in performance difference
>> > and
>> > that is all that matters to me. The gas station is an independent and
>> > what I said is true.
>>
>> Your mileage and performance dreams are just wishful thinking, and
>> indicative of what a person can convince themselves of, if they want to.
>>
>> As for the gas station... Everywhere else in the country, gas stations
>> (independent or not) usually charge an average of 20 cents more for
>> Premium than for Regular. Yet you expect people to believe that in your
>> special place, they only charge 1 cent more. Sorry, it's just too much
>> of
>> a difference to be believed.
>>
>> How about you provide a link to a picture of their sign out front, which
>> shows the prices...? Can you do that?
>
> Your email?

Post a link to the picture, thanks. All can see it then.
Tomes

Re: 2008 minivans: Honda Odyssey vs Toyota Sienna
 

In article <g5qh8g$625$1@registered.motzarella.org>,
"Tomes" <ask.me@here.net> wrote:

> "dbu" <nospam@nospam.moc> wrote in message
> news:nospam-113FFE.11344318072008@comcast.dca.giganews.com...
> > In article <pan.2008.07.18.12.55.43.923527@moria2.lan>,
> > Dan C <youmustbejoking@lan.invalid> wrote:
> >
> >> On Fri, 18 Jul 2008 07:00:07 -0500, dbu wrote:
> >>
> >> > I need not waste my time as I have no need to convince anyone. I know
> >> > what I get for mileage, I know what I feel in performance difference
> >> > and
> >> > that is all that matters to me. The gas station is an independent and
> >> > what I said is true.
> >>
> >> Your mileage and performance dreams are just wishful thinking, and
> >> indicative of what a person can convince themselves of, if they want to.
> >>
> >> As for the gas station... Everywhere else in the country, gas stations
> >> (independent or not) usually charge an average of 20 cents more for
> >> Premium than for Regular. Yet you expect people to believe that in your
> >> special place, they only charge 1 cent more. Sorry, it's just too much
> >> of
> >> a difference to be believed.
> >>
> >> How about you provide a link to a picture of their sign out front, which
> >> shows the prices...? Can you do that?
> >
> > Your email?
>
> Post a link to the picture, thanks. All can see it then.
> Tomes

I don't own a website, besides, why should I have to provide proof, I
buy my gas there, if someone does not believe me why should I care. I
don't know these people from Adam.
--

Re: 2008 minivans: Honda Odyssey vs Toyota Sienna
 

On Fri, 18 Jul 2008 11:34:43 -0500, dbu wrote:

>> How about you provide a link to a picture of their sign out front, which
>> shows the prices...? Can you do that?

> Your email?

I'm not going to provide a valid email address here... As someone else
stated, a link here will allow others to see this magical sign, too.

Go to this site below, upload your image as directed (very easy), and it
will provide you a link/URL that you can paste into a post here. Simple.

http://imageshack.us/



--
"Ubuntu" -- an African word, meaning "Slackware is too hard for me".
The Usenet Improvement Project: http://improve-usenet.org

Re: 2008 minivans: Honda Odyssey vs Toyota Sienna
 

In article <pan.2008.07.18.17.03.02.487966@moria2.lan>,
Dan C <youmustbejoking@lan.invalid> wrote:

> On Fri, 18 Jul 2008 11:34:43 -0500, dbu wrote:
>
> >> How about you provide a link to a picture of their sign out front, which
> >> shows the prices...? Can you do that?
>
> > Your email?
>
> I'm not going to provide a valid email address here... As someone else
> stated, a link here will allow others to see this magical sign, too.
>
> Go to this site below, upload your image as directed (very easy), and it
> will provide you a link/URL that you can paste into a post here. Simple.
>
> http://imageshack.us/

But why should I go to that trouble when you will only come back and say
I doctored up the photo. If you don't believe me now why should I
expect you to believe me when I post a picture someplace. Besides, I
don't care if you believe me or not.
--

Re: 2008 minivans: Honda Odyssey vs Toyota Sienna
 

"dbu" <nospam@nospam.moc> wrote in message
news:nospam-5261BD.11334018072008@comcast.dca.giganews.com...
> In article
> <e52e786a-5ea8-4f97-8f56-32df82cdcf1f@q24g2000prf.googlegroups.com>,
> Dano58 <dan.dibiase@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> I'd love to have a gas station that only charges 1 cent more for
>> super, as my Audi uses that (although I do mix in a tank of 'plus' on
>> a regular basis. I can't notice much difference in performance or
>> mileage).
>>
>> My Odyssey EX averages just under 17 mpg in town and I have gotten as
>> high as 25 on the highway - the usual is 23. That's generally with a
>> pretty loaded car (5 people plus dog and luggage) and the cruise set
>> for 76-ish. I'm happy with that. Our old Ford Crapstar used to get 15
>> in town, 20 on the highway and was a piece of besides. ;-)
>>
>> Dan D
>> '07 Ody EX
>> Central NJ USA
>
> I just talked to my buddy who has a 08 Ody which uses only three
> cylinders while on longer trips and he said he gets 32.5 MPG but that
> was using S.D. premium gas, wind at back and driving the speed limit, 65
> mph with a steady foot. Sadly, today so many people have a very heavy
> foot, I see it all the time in city traffic and on the long highway
> trips. If drivers would learn to drive like they have an egg under the
> gas pedal and hold the speed down to 65 or so, they would see much
> better gas mileage, also keep those tires inflated.
> --
>
What steady foot? That's what cruise control is for.

Re: 2008 minivans: Honda Odyssey vs Toyota Sienna
 

In article <Zd5gk.18010$Ri.15062@flpi146.ffdc.sbc.com>,
"Paul" <pkmueller@sbcglobal.net> wrote:

> "dbu" <nospam@nospam.moc> wrote in message
> news:nospam-5261BD.11334018072008@comcast.dca.giganews.com...
> > In article
> > <e52e786a-5ea8-4f97-8f56-32df82cdcf1f@q24g2000prf.googlegroups.com>,
> > Dano58 <dan.dibiase@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> >> I'd love to have a gas station that only charges 1 cent more for
> >> super, as my Audi uses that (although I do mix in a tank of 'plus' on
> >> a regular basis. I can't notice much difference in performance or
> >> mileage).
> >>
> >> My Odyssey EX averages just under 17 mpg in town and I have gotten as
> >> high as 25 on the highway - the usual is 23. That's generally with a
> >> pretty loaded car (5 people plus dog and luggage) and the cruise set
> >> for 76-ish. I'm happy with that. Our old Ford Crapstar used to get 15
> >> in town, 20 on the highway and was a piece of besides. ;-)
> >>
> >> Dan D
> >> '07 Ody EX
> >> Central NJ USA
> >
> > I just talked to my buddy who has a 08 Ody which uses only three
> > cylinders while on longer trips and he said he gets 32.5 MPG but that
> > was using S.D. premium gas, wind at back and driving the speed limit, 65
> > mph with a steady foot. Sadly, today so many people have a very heavy
> > foot, I see it all the time in city traffic and on the long highway
> > trips. If drivers would learn to drive like they have an egg under the
> > gas pedal and hold the speed down to 65 or so, they would see much
> > better gas mileage, also keep those tires inflated.
> > --
> >
> What steady foot? That's what cruise control is for.

Not when it's slippery.
--

Re: 2008 minivans: Honda Odyssey vs Toyota Sienna
 

In article <pan.2008.07.18.17.03.02.487966@moria2.lan>,
Dan C <youmustbejoking@lan.invalid> wrote:

> On Fri, 18 Jul 2008 11:34:43 -0500, dbu wrote:
>
> >> How about you provide a link to a picture of their sign out front, which
> >> shows the prices...? Can you do that?
>
> > Your email?
>
> I'm not going to provide a valid email address here... As someone else
> stated, a link here will allow others to see this magical sign, too.
>
> Go to this site below, upload your image as directed (very easy), and it
> will provide you a link/URL that you can paste into a post here. Simple.
>
> http://imageshack.us/

The price today is $3.96.9 for regular, (87) and $3.97.9 for super (89)
per U.S. gal. They have no price signs posted only at the pump. So
there ya go Dan.

BTW how old are you and what part of the country do you live in?
--

Re: 2008 minivans: Honda Odyssey vs Toyota Sienna
 

"dbu" <nospam@nospam.moc> wrote in message
news:nospam-E382C9.11512718072008@comcast.dca.giganews.com...
> In article <g5qh8g$625$1@registered.motzarella.org>,
> "Tomes" <ask.me@here.net> wrote:
>
>> "dbu" <nospam@nospam.moc> wrote in message
>> news:nospam-113FFE.11344318072008@comcast.dca.giganews.com...
>> > In article <pan.2008.07.18.12.55.43.923527@moria2.lan>,
>> > Dan C <youmustbejoking@lan.invalid> wrote:
>> >
>> >> On Fri, 18 Jul 2008 07:00:07 -0500, dbu wrote:
>> >>
>> >> > I need not waste my time as I have no need to convince anyone. I
>> >> > know
>> >> > what I get for mileage, I know what I feel in performance difference
>> >> > and
>> >> > that is all that matters to me. The gas station is an independent
>> >> > and
>> >> > what I said is true.
>> >>
>> >> Your mileage and performance dreams are just wishful thinking, and
>> >> indicative of what a person can convince themselves of, if they want
>> >> to.
>> >>
>> >> As for the gas station... Everywhere else in the country, gas
>> >> stations
>> >> (independent or not) usually charge an average of 20 cents more for
>> >> Premium than for Regular. Yet you expect people to believe that in
>> >> your
>> >> special place, they only charge 1 cent more. Sorry, it's just too
>> >> much
>> >> of
>> >> a difference to be believed.
>> >>
>> >> How about you provide a link to a picture of their sign out front,
>> >> which
>> >> shows the prices...? Can you do that?
>> >
>> > Your email?
>>
>> Post a link to the picture, thanks. All can see it then.
>> Tomes
>
> I don't own a website, besides, why should I have to provide proof, I
> buy my gas there, if someone does not believe me why should I care. I
> don't know these people from Adam.

Not disbelief, moreso curiosity. I am OK either way.
Tomes